Lifters

They are annoying!!! clik clik clik...

I got some additive thats supposed to clean the valve springs
hoping to get rid of this noise and no luck, oil levels are fine,
replace the pcv valve and valve cover gasket thinking it could
be losing oil pressure and still there. The oil pressure runs at 30psi
when running and drops to 15psi at stop lights, or when i hit the clutch.

I'm thinking that last thing to do is replace the lifters but i really don't
want to mess with the camshafts or mess up my timing, has anyone
done this before, is there a way to remove/replace the lifters without
taking the camshaft/gears out?

Try the 2twisty flush as listed on the pointy board.

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Originally Posted by Mouglie

They are annoying!!! clik clik clik... I got some additive thats supposed to clean the valve springs hoping to get rid of this noise and no luck...

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Do they click all the time? Trackdog recommends the house brand Oil Treatment stuff from O'Reilly's (see below). The theory is that the thicker Oil Treatment stays up in the lifters and keeps them from leaking down. Sounds like good science to me. I haven't tried it yet, but I've got lifters that click intermittently. However, mine haven't been clicking nearly as much since the last oil change.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mouglie

The oil pressure runs at 30psi when running and drops to 15psi at stop lights, or when i hit the clutch.

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My oil pressure runs about 20psi at idle, but normally hovers around 50psi going down the road at 3-4K rpm. When the oil is cold, my gauge will indicate over 60psi. Not sure if mine's normal, or if my gauge is off, but that's just a point of reference.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mouglie

I'm thinking that last thing to do is replace the lifters but i really don't want to mess with the camshafts or mess up my timing, has anyone done this before, is there a way to remove/replace the lifters without
taking the camshaft/gears out?

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Seeing as the lifters are under the cams, I don't see how you can get to them w/o pulling the cams out. Also, FYI, lifters are $65 EACH at the dealer, and about $20 each in the aftermarket. I'd try another additive with a fresh oil change and go from there...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by trackdog

Add 1/4 of the bottle which is about 2 ounces or so to the oil at each oil change. We have added this to several noisy Miata lifters with excellent results. The thicker oil gets into the lifters and slows down the pressure lose. Seriously, this works.

What is happening is the tiny check valve in the lifters are worn out and not holding the oil in. This will not hurt the engine, but it will be down on performance. I would not go and replace the lifters, but if you have to do any head work then at that time replace them. Aftermarket lifters are around $15-20 each where the dealer is something like $65 each.

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Anyhow... hope this helps!

thanks for the tips, its definately worth trying...

Tried some brand from pep boys, its was supposed to work in 5 minutes, nothing... tried sea foam, nope, then some blue bottle that says Oil Treatment (from autozone)... I was also told that Mazda has each lifter for $20 but i haven't checked yet...

i'm changing the oil again this tuesday with 10w30. If it turns out that the
lifters are $65 ea then i'm gonna have to take of the camshafts to get to the lifters. Since this lifter hold the oil, they can also hold air. I was told to take each lifter and submerge it in a bucket of oil and squeeze it until there are no bubbles inside, at that point the lifter should be darn hard to squeeze.

I hope this works, if not i'm gunna start kickin the crap out of everything, lol... (i really don't wanna get to the point where i pull my hair)

oh another thing, my oil pressure is also around 60psi
on cold starts... i'm guessing thats average.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mouglie

I was told to take each lifter and submerge it in a bucket of oil and squeeze it until there are no bubbles inside, at that point the lifter should be darn hard to squeeze.

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So what exactly would that accomplish??

fill em' up...

For what it's worth I had this problem with my 96 and my solution was to flush the motor really well which helped a little. The cure was to switch to 15W50 Mobile 1. This stopped all the clatter unless I just finished a session at MSR.

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Originally Posted by Mouglie

fill em' up...

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Oil from the engine fills the lifters. Is it ticking all the time or just at startup??
http://mymiata.paladinmicro.com/EngineLube.jpg

hey thanks for the pic, that will definately come in handy...

its ticking all the time, its gotten worse lately. engine still
responds alright but it feels like its always low on oil when its
not...
the reason why i wanted to fill the lifters one by one is because
they do have a very tiny hole, if there was any kind of gunk in the
oil then it probably sealed a lifter or something... like this i can find
out which lifter isn't filled and if its clogged...

That's the purpose of the 2Twistys flush on the pointy board. It uses a concoction of stuff that cleans out all the crap.

After awhile the engine has a buildup of crap inside. The oil passages on the lifters are tiny and susceptable to that buildup.

RJ

For me, switching to an OEM oil filter and Mobile 1 5w30 took care of it.

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Originally Posted by Titus

For me, switching to an OEM oil filter and Mobile 1 5w30 took care of it.

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That is a very important item to note, Mouglie... The aftermarket filters don't always have the check valve in the filter.

RJ

The ultimate fix for this (assumming you have a 1.8) is to replace the lifters with solids from a 99-00 head along with the cams. You'll also gain a little performance from this swap as reported on M.net. The down side is the pain and suffering associated with getting the shims just right. Hell, if you go this route, might as well do the Exintake cam thing to squeeze even more performance out of the engine.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mark52

The ultimate fix for this (assumming you have a 1.8) is to replace the lifters with solids from a 99-00 head along with the cams. You'll also gain a little performance from this swap as reported on M.net. The down side is the pain and suffering associated with getting the shims just right. Hell, if you go this route, might as well do the Exintake cam thing to squeeze even more performance out of the engine.

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He has a 1.6.

seems like i'm about to buy alot of oil, if it works then its well worth it...
should have results by this friday...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mouglie

seems like i'm about to buy alot of oil, if it works then its well worth it...
should have results by this friday...

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Well what are you going to do??? :confused:

http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread...light=2Twistys

2Twistys Method

If adding the thicker oil treatment did not fix the constant clicking then the only answer is to replace the ones that tick. It will do absolutely no good Mouglie to feel them up and reinstall. If the check valves are bad then you can only replace them.

I do have a 1.6 head I would sell. On one rebuild we took a bad head and sorted out the most solid lifters and replaced them. You could do the same, sell the head for $200. I can show you the good/bad lifters you want to use.

Gary

My HLA's used to make the clic noise as well and my good buddy thats a mechanic told me to put in half a bottle of Lucas heavy duty oil stabilizer.The Lucas stuff is as thick as molasses but it worked great and I've been using it for over a year now. Every time I change my oil I just add a 1/2 qt of Lucas to the normal oil. I may try the 2Twistys Method as well, just because my engine could probably use a good cleaning.

Also, I have used Seafoam in the past, but I really only recommend it for upper cylinder and intake cleaning, but thats just my opinion.

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Originally Posted by trickyrix

Also, FYI, lifters are $65 EACH at the dealer, and about $20 each in the aftermarket.

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Or $6.95 each HERE

I'd still recommend this as a last resort, though, even if the parts aren't crazy expensive, cause it's bound to be a pain in the butt.