Gonna go to the darkside!

So I got a good deal on a current generation FM Turbo with the GT2560R with the FM AA I/C but no electronics. It also came with an FM 2.5 SS down pipe. I know, I know, I work at TDR and I'm installing a turbo. Plans are to gather all the parts I need, bolt it to my 99 motor and swap it all in. The 99 motor has 75k and all the leak down numbers are 8% or less.

My goals are the following

Reliability for daily driver street and occasional track.
200-225 RWHP
Do this as inexpensively as possible

Things I need:

MegaSquirt 2 for 96-97 Miata
Wideband with AFM Gauge
Boost Gauge
Water Temp Gauge
DDM Works Radio Gauge panel
Coolant Reroute

Things I might need:

Aluminum radiator (I have a stock radiator)
Fuel Injectors
Hi Flow Fuel Pump
Inconel studs

Things I'll need down the road:

Free flow turbo dual exhaust
Wilwood BBK

So any advice or recommendations from you turbo guys would be appreciated. I've been on Miata Turbo and did searches and read the stickies. Most of that crap is over my head and honestly, I don't care to geek out. I just want a reliable FI miata with a medium level of boost. Is that too much to ask?

Hey William,

I'm running the same kit that you have, and I just pulled my engine, so if you'd like to take a gander at how it all goes together, you're welcome to swing by, but make it quick, because I'm tearing the engine down in a day or two.

If you like the way these gauges look, I can give you a hand modifying your cluster to incorporate VDO's, and boost gauge, gauge panel, and Profec S are for sale.

Here's a few pics, and links to some albums.

Engine removal & turbo kit install
Miata Gauges

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-b...4/IMG_0059.jpg
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-0...4/IMG_0040.jpg
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-_...4/IMG_0051.jpg

C

Don't kid yourself you are GOING to need the injectors, fuel pump and radiator. Do the studs since they WILL break and then you have to remove the turbo and manifold and pay a machine shop to drill them out.

Yep, he is headed down an expensive slippery slope. As much as I would like more power, I dont think my caris worth dumping that much money into it. And I am a Cheap Bastard! ;-)

Add a clutch to your list.

C

Quote:

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Originally Posted by black roadster

Reliability
200-225 RWHP
Do this as inexpensively as possible

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Pick 2.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sammm

Pick 2.

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Truth

Talk to the guys over at Trackdog Racing, they are experts in FI.

You might also give Rouge at Miata Solutions a call to find out how much it will cost to fix the mess you are going to make of your motor.

Maybe the best idea is to sell the "great deal" for a profit and thank yourself later.

Quote:

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Talk to the guys over at Trackdog Racing, they are experts in FI.

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Sometimes the jokes are a little subtle around here.

+1 on Rogue or his fab brother Rouge.

Mls head gasket and arp head studs should be on your list as well.

Also the stock clutch will start slipping around 220ish (at least that's when mine started to slip) anything below that and it holds nicely. Yes, buy injectors.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by wizzurp

Mls head gasket and arp head studs should be on your list as well.

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IMHO I'd say these are not a requirement but just added insurance. Honestly I'd only do this if I were going to run high boost or just happened to have the head off. There are plenty of other things he will be spending money on before he has to worry about these.

Thanks everyone for the info.

I'm going to right the first time even if i have to wait a while. My engine runs fine now so I'm not in a hurry. I do have a Spec Stage 2+ clutch and lightened flywheel. Will an eBay radiator like a Mishimoto be adequate or do I need to spring for a high-end unit? I imagine silicone hoses would be suggested as well for the high heat. What size injectors and will a 190LPH fuel pump work? Am I replacing all the turbo studs to inconel? Turbo to manifold and turbo to down pipe. Sources for good prices as FM and Begi charge out the ass for these.

That is also your opinion, my car went to the dyno completely bone stock, at 10 psi on the stock head gasket it went bye bye, brought it home swapped in an Mls gasket and the studs and it went back with no issues. Your mileage may vary obviously.

You know this just means more spins at Hallett, right?

I ran 10-12psi, and up to 15 on mine for 4 years on a tired, oil burning engine with no issues. Cheap and easy injectors would be RX7 550's which will fit the stock rail, and plug right in to your harness. Like you, I'm running a Spec 2+ clutch, with a 10lb flywheel which held the power just fine, and has a very easy to live with pedal feel. I think people are generally happy with the Mishimoto unit, mine is running a Koyo 55 with stock fans, distilled water, and a bottle of water wetter. I like to run the fans in parallel, and a handy trick is to disconnect the AC compressor signal wire, which allows you to use your AC button as a manual fan override.

C

Quote:

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Originally Posted by miataspeedracer

You know this just means blowing your car up at Hallett and trailering it home, right?

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Fixed for you.

440cc or 500cc injector's are recommended for 200whp (you can pick up the stock yellow RX-8 injectors for pretty cheap). Fuel pump imho isn't required if you keep it at 200hp. Doesn't TDR sell a nice radiator? As for inconel studs, go ahead it will save yourself a headache down the road.

SOOOOOOOOOOOO subscribed to this thread! :rolleyes:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by miataspeedracer

You know this just means more spins at Hallett, right?

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Yeah, but thats just once a year......The rest of the time it will be sitting in traffic.

Ill still pass you at hallet.

My $.02

Lots of people list lots of items people *need* for a basic kit like this, but I'm going to have to disagree on some. It all depends on how serious of a track guy you are. If you only go out, drive hard and have fun not trying to inch out tenths of a second, some may be overboard. I agree with everything in your "needs" list.

Injectors - DEFINITELY YES. I run RX-7 460's that have been cleaned. My car made 231whp on a mustang dyno. Thats about ~260 on a dynojet depending on who you talk to. Probably maxed out, but yet to have an issue keeping a mighty rich AFR.
Radiator - Not a bad idea. DUCTING is key here. Cheap ebay aluminum radiators are just fine.
Clutch - Yep. I also have run the ebay special F1 spec 6 puck. Not the greatest street clutch. So far it has lasted ~20k miles with ZERO issues
Fuel pump - Nope
Head gasket - I really wouldn't think so, but obviously not everyone has had good luck.
Turbo Studs - Maybe. Again, YMMV. I never had an issue, but some of the serious track guys have.

My setup on my 97 was the definition of cheap. I built it in college on a shoestring budget.
Used WRX turbo, used cheap BEGi manifold with an adapter plate, ebay intercooler/piping, RX-7 injectors that cost me <$100 including cleaning from Witchunter. My only real gauge was a cheap boost gauge and LC1 with NO AFR gauge. Ebay radiator. Homebuilt MS1 running in parallel with stock ECU.

Would I do it all over exactly like this again? HELL NO. But I was cheap and it worked. If I was on a seriously strict budget again, maybe, but changing a few things here and there. Still a big fan of the WRX turbo.
The most expensive piece on my car was the custom downpipe. I swapped in an RX-7 diff for <$140 including paying someone to set it up, much cheaper than a used Torsen. Used FM springs on used AGX's.

I run ~16psi on this setup which made the 231whp. Installed everything on the car when it had 151k miles. It has nearly 175k with about 15 track days/1 drift event and no failures other than cooling issues (I had no ducting and removed the factory ducting. I was dumb)

Obviously YMMV on what happens to you, but this can be done without having to upgrade everything on the car. Show mechanical empathy and I doubt you'll break much with those power levels.

I would sell it, too high of maintenance, but I am bias. :D

Have you not learned anything from me. Remember you sold your back up car. I NEED my back up car.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rogue

Yeah, but thats just once a year......The rest of the time it will be sitting in traffic.

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Or in your body shop...;)

OK..

Check list -

FM Turbo Kit - no electronics
FM 2.5" downpipe
Upgraded coolant and oil lines to braided stainless
99 Motor with excellent leak down number and 75k miles
Megasquirt II PnP with Brainiac's modifications
Spec Stage 2+ clutch and flywheel
Mazdaspeed motor mounts

Still need:
Trackspeed Inconel stud kit
RX8 injectors
Aluminum radiator
M-Tuned coolant reroute
190lph fuel pump
Gauges - Water, Boost and AFM
DDM Works gauge panel
Daily beater car as a back-up ::Boo::

Down the road I'll get a different exhaust

Add catch can, oil cooler and a wideband O2 sensor. Also you are going to want to do the exhaust at the same time unless you want to re-tune. You can get away with a 2.5" system but I went with 3" from the turbo back. Is the recirculating valve you have the plastic Bosh unit? If so get a better one. Also what is your plan for passing the yearly emissions test since your car is OBDII?

Noted: What do other folks with OBDII cars do about passing emissions? Well... I know what you do but can't I just put the old ECU in? Otherwise it might need to get registered to my inlaws outside Wichita Falls.

::Whisp:: Annnnnddd I'm still gonna pass ya at Hallett....::evil::

+1 on exhaust now. The difference in spool-up time alone is worth it. As much work as you're doing, it hardly makes sense to skimp on this one.

Love it. Been turbo'd for a couple of years now. Wish I had done it sooner.

Honestly, if you're serious about this, you need to just take a couple of aspirins and spend time on MT.net. Learning curve (especially MS) is steep at first, but finite.

Dealing with emissions is something to think about sooner rather than later.

Look forward to the progress and results:chug:

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Originally Posted by whoswatchingme

Look forward to the progress and results:chug:

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You're going to wait a while. I'm slowly gathering parts. I'm going to do it right the first time. Before it all goes in, I will follow everyone's advice and get a daily beater.

Parts I've gathered so far.

99 motor
Spec Stage 2+ Clutch and lightened flywheel
Current generation FM Turbo with FM Intercooler
2 1/2" FM down pipe
Stainless steel oil and coolant lines for turbo
MS2 PnP with IAT
New 3" Enthuza turbo exhaust
Walbro 255 lph fuel pump

Still need:

Aluminum radiator
Trackspeed Engineering Inconel manifold stud kit
Yellow RX-8 injectors
M-Tuned coolant reroute
Timing belt job parts
Silicone radiator hoses
Gauges
Catch can
oil cooler
New daily driver (but I got the wife talked into it!)

Just wait for the day it fires up!

Anyone find it interesting that those who have known black roadster a long time recommend against it and those who haven't say "Go for it."?::Blink::

Any one else notice how Nails can be a real prick sometimes? I have.

I've got a VDO oil temp gauge that is about as close a match to the OE NA cluster as you'll find. I put the sensor in the drain plug, so you'd need to either replace that or use that...I know we're meeting up at some point today, and I'm about to go pull some stuff off the car...just saying ;)