CSP Allignment
Seems that all the hotdogs in Street Prepared run -2.5 to -3 degrees of camber on the front and approx. 1 degree less on the rear. My current allignment is roughly -1.2F/-1.5R, which is very a streetable set-up. I only drive the car on the street to/from events, the dyno tuning shop, and the State inspection place. My question is, if I set my allignment to something like -2.5F/-1.5R, what negatives will I encounter when driving it on the street? Will it be harder to control, eat up front tires, or something else? Anybody know?
What's left of a '96 Miata with stock clutch.
My car exceeds my driving ability. That's the only possible explanation.
wear the insides of the tires pretty dern quick. unless you want alot of positve toe. but im only assuming you have zero or negative toe right now...
that would be about it... if youre ok with a little faster tire wear, (onthe inside edges,) you *should* have mroe grip autocrossing
That's less camber than my daily driven B Stock car.
An aggressive alignment will eat street tires more quickly... but your race tires will probably actually last longer, because you'll be wearing them more evenly. So, the question is which would you rather tear up quickly - cheap street tires or expensive R compounds?
Iain
"We don't stop playing because we grow old, we grow old because we stop playing." - George Bernard Shaw
BTW, your camber settings on an SP car are going to be closely related to your spring rates. Typically, the more spring you've got, the less static camber you'll use, since the car won't be traveling as far through the suspension arc anywhere on course.
That being said, I'd try running at least 2 degrees in the front to start, more if you use a "streetable" (i.e., softer) spring rate.
Iain
"We don't stop playing because we grow old, we grow old because we stop playing." - George Bernard Shaw
This is exactly how I was viewing suspension setup, but apparantly the CSP hotdogs are set up with both high spring rates AND -3 or more degrees camber (not to mention 275 Hoosiers and cut fenders!). Altiain, if you get a chance at Nationals, take a look at the CSP cars and verify this for me.Originally Posted by altiain
What's left of a '96 Miata with stock clutch.
My car exceeds my driving ability. That's the only possible explanation.
Who is giving you this information? How is a Miata getting a 275 hot enough without a co-driver? I would like to hear some tire temperature measurements from more than one person. I don't recall seeing the Hollis car with that much camber. Just adding camber because the other guys do it is not good tuning. It should be based on what temperatures you are getting across the tire now.
Are you wearing out the outside edge on the race tires in less than 70 runs?
Just my ideas on the subject.
If you run -3 degrees of camber you will notice inside wear on the street tires in about 5-8k miles.
+1. I remember having a conversation with Andy years ago about CSP alignments. While he didn't divulge his exact numbers (whaddaya expect? It was Hollis I was talking to), he did allude to running a lot less negative camber than I had initially guessed.
General is right - a probe-style pyrometer (and some poor schmuck willing to take tire temps the second you come off course) will be the best way to find out if you've got too little - or too much - camber.
I'll look at Nats, but something tells me most of the CSP guys won't appreciate me sticking a bubble gauge on their wheels in grid.
Iain
"We don't stop playing because we grow old, we grow old because we stop playing." - George Bernard Shaw
Hmm, I average 1000 miles per year on the car, soooo.....not a problem
What's left of a '96 Miata with stock clutch.
My car exceeds my driving ability. That's the only possible explanation.
"I remember having a conversation with Andy years ago about CSP alignments. While he didn't divulge his exact numbers (whaddaya expect? It was Hollis I was talking to ), he did allude to running a lot less negative camber than I had initially guessed."
Yup, Andy determined that with 700# front springs he didn't need as much negative camber. And that's the way I've set my car up over the past several years. I guess I'll try going to the extreme neg camber and see if it makes much difference. I would imagine it would be more advantagous if running Hoosiers, the Kumhos are kind of rounded on the shoulders from the start.
What's left of a '96 Miata with stock clutch.
My car exceeds my driving ability. That's the only possible explanation.
I looked at the NA CSP cars in grid at Nationals. I did not see any that looked like they had 3 degrees of negative camber in front or rear. I was looking at the cars with 13" rims. The NC might have had a lot of camber but I did not inspected it that closes since you don't have one. Think the NA cars were on Hoosiers but I could be wrong. I looked at a lot of tires this week.
Thanks, General. I just put a framing square up against my 80+ run Kumhos. They are about as evenly worn (out) as possible. I probably won't change the allignment much, if any.
What's left of a '96 Miata with stock clutch.
My car exceeds my driving ability. That's the only possible explanation.
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