Electrical troubleshooting

[sammm]

Any electricians out there?
My outlets in the garage are all dead. Not the lights, just outlets/plugs. There is a GFCI plug which I originally thought was the problem because it wouldn't reset. I replaced it, but the problem remains. The GFCI still won't reset which means there is a voltage 'leak' somewhere. I don't think it's the breaker, but can't be positive because I don't know if the plugs are on a breaker by themselves. Any ideas how/where to start troubleshooting this?

[POS Racing]

How many plugs on the circuit? Anything still plugged into the circuit?

One thing you can consider doing is to pull each plug in the circuit until the problem goes away. I had an outside plug that had a moisture issue, luckily it was the first one I pulled. YMMV

[sammm]

How many plugs on the circuit? Anything still plugged into the circuit?

One thing you can consider doing is to pull each plug in the circuit until the problem goes away. I had an outside plug that had a moisture issue, luckily it was the first one I pulled. YMMV

Garage freezer was plugged in. The huge puddle of water in the garage this morning was my clue something was wrong. There are a few other things plugged in (sprinkler timer, power strip for the workbench).
If it's garage only plugs (can't be sure), there are 4 counting the GFCI plug. 2 of them are on outside walls now that you mention moisture. They should be daisy chained off of the GFCI, correct? So pull the plugs and just cap their wires together?

PS
Outside plug on by front door still works. I think it's on a separate circuit.

[POS Racing]

Garage freezer was plugged in. The huge puddle of water in the garage this morning was my clue something was wrong. There are a few other things plugged in (sprinkler timer, power strip for the workbench).
If it's garage only plugs (can't be sure), there are 4 counting the GFCI plug. 2 of them are on outside walls now that you mention moisture. They should be daisy chained off of the GFCI, correct? So pull the plugs and just cap their wires together?

PS
Outside plug on by front door still works. I think it's on a separate circuit.

Make sure ya kick the breaker before ya mess with the 'lectric. What happens if ya unplug everything including the freezer, does the GFI still trip??

[sammm]

Make sure ya kick the breaker before ya mess with the 'lectric. What happens if ya unplug everything including the freezer, does the GFI still trip??

I turned the main off when I replaced the GFCI this afternoon. It won't reset even after I unplugged everything in the garage. New GFCI's are shipped tripped. They won't reset at all if something is wrong.

[POS Racing]

They should be daisy chained off of the GFCI, correct? So pull the plugs and just cap their wires together?

Yep, should be daisy chained.

[POS Racing]

You may want to start by just eliminating all the downstream plugs and see if you can get it to reset on it's own.

[channelmaniac]

First... pull the cover on the breaker box and measure the voltage coming off the breaker... if it's missing then you have a bad breaker.

Next, pull the cover off the first GFCI and check the wire going from the breaker box to it. If you have no voltage you have a break in the wire from the breaker box to the outlet.

If you have voltage and you have nothing on the other side of the GFCI then flip the breaker off and remove the wires from the downstream outlet. If you can't get the GFCI to reset then it's bad. If it does reset then you have a problem downstream. Reconnect and move to the next outlet in series and repeat these steps until you narrow it down.

RJ

[HudsonHawk]

Okay this may be a long shot but this happend to me. On my old house there were 2 houtside plugs. Everytime it rained the GFI would trip that protects them. When it dired up the problem went away. Turns out there was grout in the plug box that would get wet and ground out the plug. Make sure your boxes are clean.

[sammm]

You may want to start by just eliminating all the downstream plugs and see if you can get it to reset on it's own.

I could remove the 'LOAD' wires and see what happens. That would tell me if I'm getting juice from the box.

First... pull the cover on the breaker box and measure the voltage coming off the breaker

eeek!

there were 2 houtside plugs.

I have 2 outside plugs. Both are working. Hopefully they were wired after the GFCI!

[Ataim]

Sorry sammmmmm, but for electrical questions I'm the last one that you need to seek advice from.

[jrj512]

Sorry sammmmmm, but for electrical questions I'm the last one that you need to seek advice from.

No, I'm pretty sure that my advice on this would be worse. Lessee...

With the cat's tail in one hand and you left foot in a bucket of water, see if you can get your fingernail (of the hand not holding the cat) into on of those holes in the outlet far enough to make contact with the metal pieces...

[POS Racing]

You may want to start by just eliminating all the downstream plugs and see if you can get it to reset on it's own.

Were you able to reset it with the downstream plugs removed??

[channelmaniac]

eeek!

It's not that bad...

That's how I found a toasty wire that needed trimming and a bad breaker that tripped early.

I opened the panel and used my clamp on ammeter to watch the load on the line when the dryer was on. It was interesting to see the 30 Amp breaker prematurely trip with only a 20 amp load. Turns out the previous owner of the house overloaded the circuit and toasted the breaker.

It also turns out that if you have an older house with Federal Pacific breakers you should get a new wiring panel due to fire hazards. We had ours redone last year when we had the new shop building put out back and a 75 Amp sub panel installed in it.

Working with electricity isn't that scary. Just take your basic precautions with it and you'll be fine.

Oh, while you have the plugs out of the outlet boxes you should check to make sure the wires aren't loose under the screws on the sides of the outlet. That can cause those GFCI outlets to go nuts too.

RJ

[sammm]

Were you able to reset it with the downstream plugs removed??

I just tried. I removed the LOAD wires (for plugs downstream) and still the same. At this point I'm thinking the breaker is bad, but haven't tested it. Not really sure which one to test. The PO labeled the box, but when I trip the one for the 'garage plugs' the garage door opener light goes off too.

[POS Racing]

Not really sure which one to test. The PO labeled the box, but when I trip the one for the 'garage plugs' the garage door opener light goes off too.

The GFI plugs are on a separate breaker at my house from the openers.

Any when the wired my house they didn't want to dirty up the box by labeling anything.......

[sammm]

The GFI plugs are on a separate breaker at my house from the openers.

That would make sense, but how do I track down the correct breaker if I've got no live circuits to check?

[Titus]

Process of elimination? I hear a butter knife comes in handy too.

[MadMerv]

I can't imagine you have two bad GFI's. Just to be sure, remove it and tie the input and output sides together and see if 1) the breaker pops, or 2) the outlets now work.

[onething]

I can't imagine you have two bad GFI's. Just to be sure, remove it and tie the input and output sides together and see if 1) the breaker pops, or 2) the outlets now work.

or you see fire anywhere.

Step 1. See if all the breakers reset completey. Just because you flipped them the right way doesn't mean the breaker closed. Look closely to see if any of the levers seem to not be going as far toward the on position as the others.