NC Article

[Kestrel]

I know that the porsche is a 2+2, but have you ever sat in the back? Its not really a 2+2, more like a 2+.5

My kids are (a small) 9 and 4. They'll fit... damn it!

Besides, the car is mostly a daily commuter and fun toy for me, not the car we'll take on family driving vacations to Juno, Alaska. We've got the Honda Odyssey for that. On the other hand, if I'm being realistic, I should have at least the capability of hauling me and both kids to the store or something if my wife is away with the minivan. That's why the pure 2 seater would be... impractical.

But fun...

[gabkwong]

My kids are (a small) 9 and 4. They'll fit... damn it!

In 3 years they will be 12 and 7. It will be a very tight fit. Just be honest, you want a Porsche!

[Kestrel]

In 3 years they will be 12 and 7. It will be a very tight fit. Just be honest, you want a Porsche!

Yup. Kind of a "dream car" of mine from way back. But my guess is I'll end up being more practical and get the BMW (if you can call that "practical").

And in the meantime, I'm driving around in my 1999 Honda CRV, enjoying no car payments and thinking maybe I'd just be better off driving around in that POS for a while...

[MX-5EE]

Yup. Kind of a "dream car" of mine from way back. But my guess is I'll end up being more practical and get the BMW (if you can call that "practical").

And in the meantime, I'm driving around in my 1999 Honda CRV, enjoying no car payments and thinking maybe I'd just be better off driving around in that POS for a while...

I know precisely what he is talking of. My wife and I are wanting to start a family. So we figure that if I have the child and she is out, the Miata would be fine. If it's me, my wife, and the child we would take her Fit.

I know that this is all thrown out the window if/when a 2nd comes, but since we are only planning on having a first, that's a ways down the road.

PS: Also if the sports car would only be used for around town when his wife isn't coming, then the a small backseat is acceptable.

[POS Racing]

And in the meantime, I'm driving around in my 1999 Honda CRV, enjoying no car payments and thinking maybe I'd just be better off driving around in that POS for a while...

Let's watch the unauthorized use of the trademark please.

© 2008, POS Enterprises, L.L.P. POS and the POS shield design are registered trademarks of the Performance Oriented Sport Racing Team. The team names, logos and uniform designs are registered trademarks. Unauthorized use of any such Trademarks, including reproduction, imitation, dilution or confusing or misleading uses, is prohibited under the trademark laws of the United States and other countries. You are expressly prohibited from using or misusing any Trademarks.

[jrj512]

© 2008, POS Enterprises, L.L.P. POS and the POS shield design are registered trademarks ...

You need to make that your autosig.

[MX-5EE]

I also just discovered that Quaife is now selling a differential for the NC. $1295 list price though.

[Billy Blaze]

I also just discovered that Quaife is now selling a differential for the NC. $1295 list price though.

Seems like I spotted them on Ebay recently too.

[SirHustlerEsq]

I also just discovered that Quaife is now selling a differential for the NC. $1295 list price though.

I broke a trunion shaft and the case on a quaife diff in my vw. I dropped $900 on the diff, broke it 3 days later, then sent it to quaife. The would not warranty the diff because "we only warranty the diff internals, not the case or trunions." So I was left with a $1000 paper weight.

btw, I'll take the NC. It makes enough power.

[altiain]

Yup. Kind of a "dream car" of mine from way back. But my guess is I'll end up being more practical and get the BMW (if you can call that "practical").

And in the meantime, I'm driving around in my 1999 Honda CRV, enjoying no car payments and thinking maybe I'd just be better off driving around in that POS for a while...

The new 135i isn't going to be the lightest car on the market, but it's going to be a screamer. Everything I've read suggests that this will probably be the next "iconic" BMW that defines the company and the market, much like the 2002 and the E36 M3 did before it. How can you go wrong with a beautiful rwd coupe with BMW's chassis dynamics and a twin turbo motor making over 300 hp? Especially with a base price in the mid-30s. I'm going to be looking at one very hard as a replacement for the RX-8 in two or three years.

[MX-5EE]

The new 135i isn't going to be the lightest car on the market, but it's going to be a screamer. Everything I've read suggests that this will probably be the next "iconic" BMW that defines the company and the market, much like the 2002 and the E36 M3 did before it. How can you go wrong with a beautiful rwd coupe with BMW's chassis dynamics and a twin turbo motor making over 300 hp? Especially with a base price in the mid-30s. I'm going to be looking at one very hard as a replacement for the RX-8 in two or three years.

I just wish they would sell the fuel efficient inline 4 sedan and wagon models in the US instead of just the coupe. I already have my fun car, and I am happy with it :)

Now a fuel efficient luxury car, that I would be interested in.

As for the Quaife diff, I more pointed that out because I am happy that companies are now finally starting to give serious aftermarket support to the NC. I will have to remember what you said though about the quality. I really would like some sort of LSD at some point.

[Kestrel]

The new 135i isn't going to be the lightest car on the market, but it's going to be a screamer. Everything I've read suggests that this will probably be the next "iconic" BMW that defines the company and the market, much like the 2002 and the E36 M3 did before it. How can you go wrong with a beautiful rwd coupe with BMW's chassis dynamics and a twin turbo motor making over 300 hp? Especially with a base price in the mid-30s. I'm going to be looking at one very hard as a replacement for the RX-8 in two or three years.

I agree. It's only a couple of hundred pounds lighter than the 3 Series, and the reviews are saying it has some slight understeer under hard cornering. But the aftermarket will solve that, and I like the size and shape of the 1 series better than the 3 (and the 3 ain't bad) -- just suits me better.

My only two concerns with the car -- aside from it being a 1st year edition in 2008 -- are:

1. Run-flat tires and no spare (not a big deal, as I'd throw out the run-flat crap, and just use AAA if I had a flat), and
2. BMW's declining repair record/reputation. I don't expect a high-performance car to never need repair, but I'm hearing/reading horror stories about people being without their car for months. OK, BMW provides a loaner, but who wants to pay $40k to drive around in a 3 year old Ford Focus... and who's got time to go back and forth to the dealership? You're not a student anymore you know altiain, so you don't have all that free time on your hands.

Of course, a 3 year old Porsche 911 isn't likely to be a "model of low and inexpensive maintenance" either. Well, I'll just keep mulling it over and driving my POJ*


* Respecting the expressed wishes of our esteemed member, POS Racing, I will henceforth refer to the rust-on-green 1999 Honda CR-V that I am currently driving as POJ. Although I am not convinced of his exclusive rights to the term he refers to (having seen this used in many wirtings, I believe it has become "un-trademarkable", much like "Aspirin" lost it's exclusive rights to that brand name when it became generally synonymous with "pain-relief medicine"), I will acquiesce to Mr. Racing's demands in the name of peace and harmony on this Forum.

[POS Racing]

* Respecting the expressed wishes of our esteemed member, POS Racing, I will henceforth refer to the rust-on-green 1999 Honda CR-V that I am currently driving as POJ. Although I am not convinced of his exclusive rights to the term he refers to (having seen this used in many wirtings, I believe it has become "un-trademarkable", much like "Aspirin" lost it's exclusive rights to that brand name when it became generally synonymous with "pain-relief medicine"), I will acquiesce to Mr. Racing's demands in the name of peace and harmony on this Forum.

[POS Racing]

Oh yea, don't be a get the 911!

[altiain]

I agree. It's only a couple of hundred pounds lighter than the 3 Series, and the reviews are saying it has some slight understeer under hard cornering. But the aftermarket will solve that, and I like the size and shape of the 1 series better than the 3 (and the 3 ain't bad) -- just suits me better.

My only two concerns with the car -- aside from it being a 1st year edition in 2008 -- are:

1. Run-flat tires and no spare (not a big deal, as I'd throw out the run-flat crap, and just use AAA if I had a flat), and
2. BMW's declining repair record/reputation. I don't expect a high-performance car to never need repair, but I'm hearing/reading horror stories about people being without their car for months. OK, BMW provides a loaner, but who wants to pay $40k to drive around in a 3 year old Ford Focus... and who's got time to go back and forth to the dealership? You're not a student anymore you know altiain, so you don't have all that free time on your hands.

Of course, a 3 year old Porsche 911 isn't likely to be a "model of low and inexpensive maintenance" either. Well, I'll just keep mulling it over and driving my POJ*

The funny thing is… a 135i has about the same horsepower, about the same weight, a bigger trunk and more rear seat space than a late 996-era 911. A guy I work with has a beautiful ’00 or ‘01 996, and he’s let me drive it a couple of times. It’s a good car, but not a great car. The ergonomics are a little strange, the seats are flat and unsupportive, the interior is chintzy, and it isn’t exactly blindingly fast. Personally, the E46 M3 grabs me more than a 996 as both a fun car and a daily driver.

As for service work… I drive a first year RX-8, so I’ve had my fair share of service loaners. Truthfully, I don’t mind – even though I drive a lowly Mazda, I’ve always been put in nice, late model rentals. The last time my car was in the shop I got a brand new CX-7, and that’s only because the CX-9 that they had was already out with someone else. Last I checked the local BMW dealers all had service loaners, and they were either 325is or X3s – not exactly a Ford Focus. Besides, almost all dealers have extended hours these days. Dropping my car off for warranty work isn’t something I look forward to, but it’s pretty painless.

I think I’d much rather spend ~$40k on a brand new Bimmer than a five or six year old 911 (because you’re gonna spend more than that on a decent three year old one). Then again, if I could afford a three year old 911, I’d be looking real hard for the right one year old Cayman S instead, but that’s just me.

[Miatamoto]

Don't forget about the free service for 3 years on the BMW!

[Kestrel]

The funny thing is… a 135i has about the same horsepower, about the same weight...

<snip>

... one year old Cayman S instead, but that’s just me.

altiain, I'm enjoying your perspective on my 135i v 996/7 deliberations! Maybe some moderhater should split off this discussion into a "Cheesecake Contemplates a New Car" or "BMW 135i or Slightly Used Porsche 911... which would you choose?" thread, since we've drifted from the original meaning of the post.

But to continue the drift ('cuz I find it much more interesting than the original content anyway), unfortunately the Cayman S falls into the same "impractical" bucket as an S2000 or MazdaSpeed MX5 NC -- no room for me and 2 kids. I really like the Cayman S! And didn't I read somewhere that a Cayman S now holds the record for the fastest lap of the Nurburgring in a production car? Well, whatever the case, the Cayman S is one hot car...

So if it's a new 135i (easily $40k when optioned up a little) versus a used 911, here's an example:

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?car_id=236238003&dealer_id=47344293&car_ye ar=2003&model=911&num_records=50&systime=&make2=&s tart_year=2003&keywordsfyc=&keywordsrep=&engine=&c ertified=&body_code=0&fuel=&awsp=false&search_type =both&distance=25&marketZipError=false&search_lang =en&make=POR&color=&page_location=findacar%3A%3Ais psearchform&min_price=333&drive=&default_sort=pric eDESC&max_mileage=30000&style_flag=1&sort_type=pri ceDESC&address=75034&advanced=y&end_year=2008&door s=&transmission=Manual&max_price=50000&cardist=12(and you're right... since it's now 2008, this is actually a 5 year old car!).

A low mileage used 911 in [what appears to be] excellent condition for $47k. Talk 'um down a bit, and that should be had for $43-$44k. So is it worth $4,000 -- and 5 years and 27k miles -- to get an "exotic dream car". That's a rhetorical question of course, because it will come down to personal preference... and possibly a "seat of the pants, go with your heart" decision. Heck, I bought a 1972 Volkswagen Bus that I knew was in lousy shape, just because I had to have one (That was in 1985. I bought it for $1,200, paid about $1,500 in repairs, owned it for 8 months, and gladly unloaded on someone for $100. I haven't made that mistake since...). Maybe I'm just trying to talk myself into ignoring my better judgment and just "go for it" again. But I keep remembering what happened last time I did that with the VW...




_____________________

PS. Sorry about the long link thing in the post. I don't remember how to do the cool thing where you see a "link", not the full web address...

[Kestrel]

Don't forget about the free service for 3 years on the BMW!

Yeah, that's an excellent point. I've never really considered leasing a car, but perhaps that's the easy answer: Lease a BMW for 3 years, and then turn it in when the maintenance and repair costs [could] start hitting. Over the past 8 years, I've averaged well under 10,000 miles per year (closer to 5,000), so that wouldn't factor in...

Oh, and it's actully 4 years maintenance included now!

[POS Racing]

Have you looked at the Porsche CPO Program = http://www.porsche.com/usa/pre-owned-vehicles/approved/

Every Porsche Approved vehicle comes with a comprehensive Warranty
- If sold while under the new car warranty, Coverage is up to 6 years or 100,000m/160,000km total , whichever comes first
- If sold once the new vehicle warranty has expired, Coverage is 2 years from the date of sale or up to 100,000m/160,000km, whichever comes first

[altiain]

altiain, I'm enjoying your perspective on my 135i v 996/7 deliberations! Maybe some moderhater should split off this discussion into a "Cheesecake Contemplates a New Car" or "BMW 135i or Slightly Used Porsche 911... which would you choose?" thread, since we've drifted from the original meaning of the post.

But to continue the drift ('cuz I find it much more interesting than the original content anyway), unfortunately the Cayman S falls into the same "impractical" bucket as an S2000 or MazdaSpeed MX5 NC -- no room for me and 2 kids. I really like the Cayman S! And didn't I read somewhere that a Cayman S now holds the record for the fastest lap of the Nurburgring in a production car? Well, whatever the case, the Cayman S is one hot car...

So if it's a new 135i (easily $40k when optioned up a little) versus a used 911, here's an example:

A low mileage used 911 in [what appears to be] excellent condition for $47k. Talk 'um down a bit, and that should be had for $43-$44k. So is it worth $4,000 -- and 5 years and 27k miles -- to get an "exotic dream car".

Meh. It's a 911, but it looks like a pretty basic example of a Carrera. No upgraded brakes, base 17" wheels, etc. It looks well maintained, but it's a pretty plain Jane example of the breed.

By contrast, you could spend an extra $2k and get this 2006 Cayman S with the Sport Chrono Pack and satnav. Three years newer, still under warranty, better interior, better exterior (imho), and much better equipped.

So it's gotta have a backseat to pass it under the "family friendly" radar? The check this out. 2005 BMW M3 with Competition Package, Premium Package, satnav, sunroof, etc. Look at this interior:



How gorgeous is that? Here's your '03 911 by comparison:



Looks kinda antiquated to me. Is that a steering wheel from a schoolbus in there?

I'm just giving you a hard time. I understand the allure of the 911 - they've always been high on my list of dream cars as well. However, after driving an "average" 996, I came away unimpressed. It's a good car, but it wasn't anywhere near as magical as I thought it should be.

Of course, to each their own. You might drive a 996 Carrera and fall in love. But I'd cross shop the E46 M3, the 135i, the Cayman, and perhaps a few others. Who knows which one you will prefer?