Are They Out Of Their Frxxking Mind!?

[goofygrin]

so don't buy one?

[jeepinbanditrider]

so don't buy one?

I don't plan on it. However I would like to see a company do well making viable alternative energy vehicles. And I have a feeling this will do as well as most other options out there.......not very well. But that's just what I think the market could prove me wrong.

[goofygrin]

you mean like hundreds of thousands of priuses being sold a year?

or the shortages of VW TDi Jettas that we've been experiencing since they came out?

Of course BMW is singing the woes of trying to sell a diesel in the US market with their X5d and 335d, but their products are stupid expensive and their dealers are douchebags, so I don't bemoan them anything.

If you're talking about fuel cells, that's just stupid technology...

[trickyrix]

I get 165-180 miles in the Evo on a tank of E85 (12 gallons).

Why on earth are you running E85 in that thing? By my math, you're getting 15mpg - best case.

***

As for the Leaf... a pure electric might be fine for errands/light commuting in a confined urban area, but in most parts of this country it will be a niche car - a toy, really. Unless you had easy access to long-distance public transportation (trains, planes, etc), you'd still have to have a real car for trips of any substance. And by "real car" I mean one with access to a widespread, convenient, and quick refueling (recharging) infrastructure. In my mind, the Volt is better suited to primary car duty. If I had to speculate, the future (at least in this country) lies in some sort of hybrid car - of the fuel-cell variety, not the stopgap gas or diesel hybrids.

I'd rather see tax subsidies for more ambitious technology than hybrids and pure electrics, but at least this is a way to get batteries and motors some real world development.

[altiain]

He's running E85 because everyone needs 450 whp for the daily commute.

As for me, I'm all for electric cars. The more the merrier. Did I mention that I design mining equipment for a living? The more electric vehicles, the more machines we sell to coal and lithium mines. Bring it!

[trickyrix]

If you're talking about fuel cells, that's just stupid technology...

What's wrong with fuel cells?

[goofygrin]

Why on earth are you running E85 in that thing? By my math, you're getting 15mpg - best case.

***

As for the Leaf... a pure electric might be fine for errands/light commuting in a confined urban area, but in most parts of this country it will be a niche car - a toy, really. Unless you had easy access to long-distance public transportation (trains, planes, etc), you'd still have to have a real car for trips of any substance. And by "real car" I mean one with access to a widespread, convenient, and quick refueling (recharging) infrastructure. In my mind, the Volt is better suited to primary car duty. If I had to speculate, the future (at least in this country) lies in some sort of hybrid car - of the fuel-cell variety, not the stopgap gas or diesel hybrids.

I'd rather see tax subsidies for more ambitious technology than hybrids and pure electrics, but at least this is a way to get batteries and motors some real world development.

What Iain said You don't ask the same thing of the people driving a suburban by themselves to work do you?

And I think that most suburban dwelling people will still have two vehicles, one that's an around town, EV (or similar) and one "long range" vehicle for those trips out of town and the like. Honestly for the really long trips (Florida and Colorado) I've taken to renting a car. It's more expensive, but I don't put the miles and wear and tear on one of my cars and when I get home I don't care about how funky it is, I just drop it back off

[Titus]

Yep... E-85 is much higher octane than pump gas, allowing turbo guys to run much more boost without knock. There are a few turbo Miatas running E85 at around 500hp (including a former dfwmiata member).

[goofygrin]

What's wrong with fuel cells?

You mean other than "they'll be a viable technology soon" for 20 years? The hundreds of thousands of existing fuel stations that would need to be converted to providing the fuel for the cells, etc, etc, etc.

I liked the Volt when it was first pitched. I'd still buy one, but they keep lowering the ev only range and raising the price.

[goofygrin]

Yep... E-85 is much higher octane than pump gas, allowing turbo guys to run much more boost without knock. There are a few turbo Miatas running E85 at around 500hp (including a former dfwmiata member).

boost and timing

[Billy Blaze]

$25k + $1100 for the 4 hour charger installed at your home after all government incentives pay out... You really should be more appalled that your tax dollars are funding $9k per buyer than the cost of the car, but I'm not sure I'm allowed to say that in this forum...

Alright TC !!!!

[trickyrix]

You don't ask the same thing of the people driving a suburban by themselves to work do you?

Ah... I didn't know you had a 450-horse commuter.

I don't question those folks to their face, but I do sometimes the wisdom of commuting in a 3-ton behemoth. We've got a guy here at work who commutes in a friggin' Excursion, and he's got a nasty habit of backing into parked cars because he can't see out of the damn thing.

[jeepinbanditrider]

you mean like hundreds of thousands of priuses being sold a year?

or the shortages of VW TDi Jettas that we've been experiencing since they came out?

Of course BMW is singing the woes of trying to sell a diesel in the US market with their X5d and 335d, but their products are stupid expensive and their dealers are douchebags, so I don't bemoan them anything.

If you're talking about fuel cells, that's just stupid technology...

And it's been argued that the companies who make them either take a loss or barely break even. They can keep doing that due to govt. incentives and the amount of other cars they sell.

I hope you aren't taking what I say personally I support research into alternative fuels however on that same token I want my tax money to be invested wisely not pissed into the wind............though they do that on other things besides this subject lol.

[motorollow]

I still want a CNG hybrid. No need to go to the local Valero or Shell station AND go more than 100 miles.

[Dave04]

Just curious... has anyone seen a range estimate on the Leaf if you, say, turn on the AC? That would be very important for me here in Texas...

[jeepinbanditrider]

Just curious... has anyone seen a range estimate on the Leaf if you, say, turn on the AC? That would be very important for me here in Texas...

Good quesiton :)

[goofygrin]

And it's been argued that the companies who make them either take a loss or barely break even. They can keep doing that due to govt. incentives and the amount of other cars they sell.

I hope you aren't taking what I say personally I support research into alternative fuels however on that same token I want my tax money to be invested wisely not pissed into the wind............though they do that on other things besides this subject lol.

Ya, there are a lot bigger fish to fry (*cough* wars *cough*) than this.... I'm all for research, but I think you have to turn a practical eye to it. I want a Mr. Fusion!

Just curious... has anyone seen a range estimate on the Leaf if you, say, turn on the AC? That would be very important for me here in Texas...

We were joking about this. 100 miles without headlights, radio, ac, windows up, no stopping, etc.

[jeepinbanditrider]

Ya, there are a lot bigger fish to fry (*cough* wars *cough*) than this.... I'm all for research, but I think you have to turn a practical eye to it. I want a Mr. Fusion!



We were joking about this. 100 miles without headlights, radio, ac, windows up, no stopping, etc.

I want a complementry Flux Capacitor when I pick mine up lol.

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