99 Miata, no start, rebuilt engine, about to drive me nuts...

[71dsp]

It's a bit of a long story, so bear with me. :) Any suggestions, help, advice, or anything is GREATLY appreciated!!

A few months ago, my wife tried to start her 99, and according to her the car ran VERY rough and it sounded like there was some metal on metal contact (she described it as a banging sound). So she shut it off, and tried to restart. It wouldn't start. When I got home, I checked a few of the obvious items with no success. That weekend, I did a compression test and leak down test. The compression test was not good. Two cylinders were less than 100 PSI with 10%+ leak. I figured this was the problem. I removed the head, and other than a ton of carbon build up and a really oily intake manifold, everything appeared to be in order.

I had planned to rebuild the engine myself, but due to time constraints, I had John Day at Day Custom Engines do the rebuild for me. During the teardown, he said everything looked fairly normal for an engine with 145k miles on it. So far so good.

When I attempted to install the crank angle sensor, the mounting tab for the sensor was not machined completely. I consulted John, and he suggested just grinding the offending area a bit. I did so and was able to mount the sensor without any further issues. Once the engine was installed, I noticed there was no tab for the alternator mount. After discussing this with John a bit, it seems the wrong water pump was used (perhaps a 1.6?). I ordered a replacement pump from Finishline and did the swap myself. No big deal, I've done plenty of timing belt jobs.

So here I am today with a non-running Miata. It'll act like it's trying to start and sputter, but it'll never run on its own.

Here's a list of the new parts, what I've done, and what I've checked. Maybe I've missed something!

Rebuilt engine
new cam sensor
new crank sensor
new coils
new plugs
new plug wires
new fuel pump
cleaned injectors (verified operation via bench testing)

Fuel pressure appears good, as the plugs are wet when removed after attempting to start the car. I tried my old set of coils along with the brand new ones with the same results.

At first, the engine was giving me a code for the crank angle sensor and cam angle sensor. I adjusted the crank angle sensor some and that code went away, but I'm still getting the code for the cam angle sensor.

Yesterday a friend with a 99 came over. I swapped my ECU and cam angle sensor into his car. It started right up, so I know those are good.

I've checked for power and ground at both coils, cam angle sensor and crank angle sensor. All are good. Each injector has +12V. Fuel pump is getting power with a good ground. I checked the wiring from the ECU to both coils, cam angle sensor, crank angle sensor, and all four injectors. All the wiring appears to be good (continuity with impedance less than 0.2 ohms). All grounds on the engine appear good.

Now for the weird part. Since my friend was over, we put a timing gun on the car. Plugs 2 and 3 are getting spark. Plugs 1 and 4 never fired. I tried this with the new coils and with the "old" coils. Same result.

So I'm seriously frustrated at this point, but it appears to be an issue with wiring or the timing is so fubar that the ECU is confused and only fires two cylinders??

I emailed John yesterday, so I'm hoping to hear from him today. I'm beginning to think that I need to replace the oil pump, which will be no fun at all...

Any other ideas? Anyone willing to take a look at it? At this point, I'm willing to pay someone. I've just about lost patience. Fortunately, we have 3 street vehicles, so my wife has been driving the tow vehicle to/from work, which is suboptimal, and she wants her car back. :)

Feel free to ask questions. I'll answer them as best I can. Thanks guys!

[ken o]

Did you try his ECU in your car?

Could it be a grounding issue?

[altiain]

I emailed John yesterday, so I'm hoping to hear from him today. I'm beginning to think that I need to replace the oil pump, which will be no fun at all...

Any other ideas? Anyone willing to take a look at it? At this point, I'm willing to pay someone. I've just about lost patience. Fortunately, we have 3 street vehicles, so my wife has been driving the tow vehicle to/from work, which is suboptimal, and she wants her car back. :)

Billy,

I'm sorry that your experience with John Day has been frustrating so far, to say the least. At this point I would suggest you contact Stevan Boyd with Miata Solutions and tow the car up to his shop near TMS... although you may not be interested in my advice any more.

[MadMerv]

Check the wiring harness at the back of the engine. I've seen them get pinched when the engine went back in and have caused either 1/4 or 2/3 not to fire. Did you pull the tranny? If not, could have caught that harness between the two when re-coupled.

John is good. It's not like him to install wrong parts........

[MadMerv]

Did you try his ECU in your car?

Could it be a grounding issue?

There is a ground strap below the CAI. make sure it was connected to the block.

[71dsp]

I did not try his ECU in my car. My ECU worked perfectly in his car. It started right up, no hesitation.

It could be a grounding issue, but I'm fairly sure I reinstalled all the OEM grounds. There is one on the injector harness, one on the gasket between the trans and engine, one on the rear of the PPF, and that's about all I can remember. Perhaps I missed one? I checked ground on various parts of the engine (valve cover, head, etc), and had good ground everywhere.

There is a clifford alarm on the car, and it appears to function correctly. It has an RPM monitor that locks the doors at some default RPM. I'm wondering if that is somehow causing a problem. It seems doubtful, but at this point, I'm very unsure!!

[POS Racing]

You sure the trigger plate for the crank sensor isn't mounted backwards? It can be and the car will not start.

+1! For Stevan Boyd!

[71dsp]

Merv, thanks for the suggestions. The transmission was pulled separately from the engine during the R&R work. The harness appears to be in good condition, but you are right, it's a tight fit between the chassis and the engine where the harness passes through.

CAI = cold air intake?

Iain, at this point, I'd gladly pay another $500 to get the car running. I'm so backed up on car projects, housework, etc. because of this problem that it would totally be worth it, IMO!! I'll try some of Merv's suggestions tonight and if I don't have any success, I'll contact that shop next week. Fortunately, I have a truck and trailer! Email sent to Miata Solutions. We'll see what he has to say. Thanks!

[71dsp]

You sure the trigger plate for the crank sensor isn't mounted backwards? It can be and the car will not start.

+1! For Stevan Boyd!

No I'm not sure. I thought it only mounted in one direction! When I did the water pump swap, I could not get the crank pulley bolt out like I've been able to on all the other timing belt jobs, so I removed the 4 bolts for the crank pulley and pulled the crank pulley and plate off to get the lower cover off.

How can I ensure that the plate is installed properly?

[71dsp]

BTW, I'm not knocking John's work at all. I went to him due to the great comments I received, and he's been great to work with. I was quite surprised myself with the water pump and oil pump issue. Let's just hope I don't need to swap the oil pump! It did make enough pressure to trigger the OEM oil pressure "gauge" when I did my initial priming.

[POS Racing]

No I'm not sure. I thought it only mounted in one direction! When I did the water pump swap, I could not get the crank pulley bolt out like I've been able to on all the other timing belt jobs, so I removed the 4 bolts for the crank pulley and pulled the crank pulley and plate off to get the lower cover off.

How can I ensure that the plate is installed properly?

The car runs!

I'm not 100% sure how you tell but you won’t get ignition in the correct order if it is reversed* and it is a pretty common mistake.

*Car will studder and pop and not fire. BTDT

[71dsp]

NICE! I'm going to swap it around tonight after I get home from work and crank up the AC in the garage.

[POS Racing]

You know what you can do with that A/C in your garage!

Let us know what ya figure out!

[71dsp]

Ok. I'll post up tonight.

I just got the AC in the garage working. I have a large window on the side that faces the street, so I couldn't install a window unit permanently, and I can't afford a central or split unit at this point, so I bought a 24k BTU Frigidaire from Lowes and built a stand with a set of HD drawer sliders and a big flange on the mount. When I need the AC, I open the window, slide the unit out, and turn it on. Works great, but I need to refine the flange a bit to get a better seal. After I get all this Miata mess figured out, that's high on my list. Fortunately, the unit holds the AC in place since I put 300 lbs worth of ballast in the base. I used ball bearing casters, so I can move it easily if I need to. It also helps that the garage is insulated and the doors are insulated as well. If you ever need to do some car work, let me know. :)

[Rogue]

My bet is on the Crank Plate or its fuel fouled.

Email returned.

[71dsp]

I'm going to try the crank plate ASAP. I'll clean up the plugs as well before I try again as well.

[71dsp]

WOOHOO!! IT'S ALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLIVE!!!

Turns out it was the crank plate. I swapped it around and it started right up. Oh what a sound for sore ears!!

[Sharpie]

Congrats, That's awesome! Way to go MME.

[71dsp]

Yes, thank you very much everyone for the suggestions!

[altiain]

Congrats, Billy!

Guess you should have asked on here instead of the Prelude board last week.