Forced Induction Options

[Tim the Teacher]

I have had a JR sc in my car for almost 50K. Been on the track numerous times and no problem. The car has an a/a IC, PWR radiator, and a high temp thermostat that has worked well to negate any cooling issues. I have been completely satisfied with the extra 60 hp I got out of the blower.

[smartmx5]

Yeah...drive a car with 250whp from a dynodynamics and you'll totally disagree.

As for driving anything the way a racecar should be driven, you'll need a bigger radiator with some shrouding on the front and an oil cooler with ducting. I suspect a vented hood will help your cause too. I didn't need to flip on my fans until it hit 90* ambient on the track with a standard hood and ghetto ducting on the front.

I can't speak first hand on supercharged cars because I don't own one, but it looks like you can run any TDR kit and endure no mechanical issues. I have a BEGi S3 kit at roughly 300whp/290wtq and my only issue is keeping hardware tight in my cast-log manifold. I wish I had gone v-bands on everything or at least a verticle mount tubular manifold. I've also only done 1 track event so the jury is still out.

At 250whp and less you will be fine on the standard 1.8 brakes with good pads but I recommend brake ducting. I was entering little bend and rattle snake at 120mph+ all day or so without brake ducting and never had fade, but the pads saw too much heat with sport brakes, and my car is around 2300lb.

I agree it would be nice to have HUGE hp, however, most cars that I know, that are on the track once a month or more, that are FI have overheating problems. That is why I like the idea of having only 40-60 hp.

[jeepinbanditrider]

I'm way more into handling than straight out horsepower. The only major gripe I have with the Miata is a lack of power for the cars intended purpose. A bit more power would have done wonders for the car IMO.

[jeff_man]

Very few people who start down the boosted path are ever truly happy with just another 40-60 HP..

i got +100whp and a hole new car with all the parts i had installed. still need more

looking for a 99 head to have built and then ecu for more power

crack might be a cheaper drug then boost.

[SirHustlerEsq]

I agree it would be nice to have HUGE hp, however, most cars that I know, that are on the track once a month or more, that are FI have overheating problems. That is why I like the idea of having only 40-60 hp.

Well, the cars which overheat don't respect Bernoulli's Principle. Seal the front of the heat exchangers, rather than increasing frontal area, and lower pressure behind them (vented hood and / or belly pan that goes back to the steering rack) and the car will cool effectively. The local racecar I've crewed for has a sheetmetal chamber in front of the heat exchangers with a vented hood on a v-mount set-up with a foil to direct only 1"x24" of air to the radiator and the car cooled just fine in 100* heat in the desert. TDR cars do not overheat because not only do they use a good radiator, but Gary makes ducting to go along with them. I have ghetto heat exchangers and didn't need the fans until 90* because my plastic ducting tore through the rivets. I will be able to run this car on the track in 100* heat without using fans when I get the hood on it.

I agree with Altain...250whp is just right. Its enough to throttle steer the car in 5th or 6th on sweepers, but not an obscene amount where you have to worry about oil pump failure, gear oil temps, and it still allows for some margin-of-error.

I'm way more into handling than straight out horsepower. The only major gripe I have with the Miata is a lack of power for the cars intended purpose. A bit more power would have done wonders for the car IMO.

I am too, but when you get in a miata that makes enough power to use the suspenson and mechanical grip in every corner, you'll like the power too. Sure, most douch-bags with big power cars like to treat the course like a drag-strip...you become a man when you can do more.


I've recently realized that I made a MAJOR mistake with my turbo kit and I'm spending $2k to remedy it because not only do I track the car frequently, but apparently I drive at a different level than the average consumer out there based upon my problems with turbo fasteners. I don't think people realize the demands we put on our cars mechanically. Look at endurance racing from big money teams...we want Audi's racetrack reliability in a $5k kit and I bet you expect to get more than 12-track events out of your car (24-hours of seat time). You're going to have to pay a bit to get there but you get it in TDR's kit...I've had to do a lot more to get my turbo car there...hopefully I've made it.

[ROCKDOC]

Well, the cars which overheat don't respect Bernoulli's Principle. Seal the front of the heat exchangers, rather than increasing frontal area, and lower pressure behind them (vented hood and / or belly pan that goes back to the steering rack) and the car will cool effectively. The local racecar I've crewed for has a sheetmetal chamber in front of the heat exchangers with a vented hood on a v-mount set-up with a foil to direct only 1"x24" of air to the radiator and the car cooled just fine in 100* heat in the desert. TDR cars do not overheat because not only do they use a good radiator, but Gary makes ducting to go along with them. I have ghetto heat exchangers and didn't need the fans until 90* because my plastic ducting tore through the rivets. I will be able to run this car on the track in 100* heat without using fans when I get the hood on it.

I agree with Altain...250whp is just right. Its enough to throttle steer the car in 5th or 6th on sweepers, but not an obscene amount where you have to worry about oil pump failure, gear oil temps, and it still allows for some margin-of-error.


I am too, but when you get in a miata that makes enough power to use the suspenson and mechanical grip in every corner, you'll like the power too. Sure, most douch-bags with big power cars like to treat the course like a drag-strip...you become a man when you can do more.


I've recently realized that I made a MAJOR mistake with my turbo kit and I'm spending $2k to remedy it because not only do I track the car frequently, but apparently I drive at a different level than the average consumer out there based upon my problems with turbo fasteners. I don't think people realize the demands we put on our cars mechanically. Look at endurance racing from big money teams...we want Audi's racetrack reliability in a $5k kit and I bet you expect to get more than 12-track events out of your car (24-hours of seat time). You're going to have to pay a bit to get there but you get it in TDR's kit...I've had to do a lot more to get my turbo car there...hopefully I've made it.

Oh quit " whining".......- you sure your not that Gay basketball player?

[SirHustlerEsq]

Oh quit " whining".......- you sure your not that Gay basketball player?

oops, wrong Celt. lol

[ROCKDOC]

oops, wrong Celt. lol

[smartmx5]

Well, the cars which overheat don't respect Bernoulli's Principle. Seal the front of the heat exchangers, rather than increasing frontal area, and lower pressure behind them (vented hood and / or belly pan that goes back to the steering rack) and the car will cool effectively. The local racecar I've crewed for has a sheetmetal chamber in front of the heat exchangers with a vented hood on a v-mount set-up with a foil to direct only 1"x24" of air to the radiator and the car cooled just fine in 100* heat in the desert. TDR cars do not overheat because not only do they use a good radiator, but Gary makes ducting to go along with them. I have ghetto heat exchangers and didn't need the fans until 90* because my plastic ducting tore through the rivets. I will be able to run this car on the track in 100* heat without using fans when I get the hood on it.

I agree with Altain...250whp is just right. Its enough to throttle steer the car in 5th or 6th on sweepers, but not an obscene amount where you have to worry about oil pump failure, gear oil temps, and it still allows for some margin-of-error.


I am too, but when you get in a miata that makes enough power to use the suspenson and mechanical grip in every corner, you'll like the power too. Sure, most douch-bags with big power cars like to treat the course like a drag-strip...you become a man when you can do more.


I've recently realized that I made a MAJOR mistake with my turbo kit and I'm spending $2k to remedy it because not only do I track the car frequently, but apparently I drive at a different level than the average consumer out there based upon my problems with turbo fasteners. I don't think people realize the demands we put on our cars mechanically. Look at endurance racing from big money teams...we want Audi's racetrack reliability in a $5k kit and I bet you expect to get more than 12-track events out of your car (24-hours of seat time). You're going to have to pay a bit to get there but you get it in TDR's kit...I've had to do a lot more to get my turbo car there...hopefully I've made it.

Let me rephase my earlier statement. Most MIATAs with BIG horsepower that are tracked frequently and hard, overheat. I guess I will wait to see a TDR package that will be driven as hard as I drive and as often. I have yet to see a turbo charged unit on the track driven out here not overheat. Maybe Verges' car? I will need to check with him...
Now to google or Bing 'Bernoulli's Principle'.

[johnwag]

I guess I will wait to see a TDR package that will be driven as hard as I drive and as often.

Wait? Gary's red 99 was at the TDR event.......

[smartmx5]

Wait? Gary's red 99 was at the TDR event.......

I was instructing and never got to speak with Gary. Would have liked to corner him on the subject.

[SirHustlerEsq]

Let me rephase my earlier statement. Most MIATAs with BIG horsepower that are tracked frequently and hard, overheat. I guess I will wait to see a TDR package that will be driven as hard as I drive and as often. I have yet to see a turbo charged unit on the track driven out here not overheat. Maybe Verges' car? I will need to check with him...
Now to google or Bing 'Bernoulli's Principle'.

I did it at the TDR event. My car made 261whp/252wtq on a dynodynamics before I added COPs and 1/2" to the exhaust. I'm well into 300whp on a dynojet.

[smartmx5]

I did it at the TDR event. My car made 261whp/252wtq on a dynodynamics before I added COPs and 1/2" to the exhaust. I'm well into 300whp on a dynojet.

What were your times at the track that weekend? I am curious. I drive an instructor friends miata with 225 hp at the rear wheel. I have followed street driven GT3s with established drivers and the car overheated. It is a FM 2 turbo kit, with all the goodies to cool it off, largest radiator, Spaal fans, ducting like no tomorrow, etc. It also depends on the ambient temps. Anything below about 80*, it takes until the afternoon to overheat. Then there is the reliability. I do not want issues like you stated you had with your car...

[SirHustlerEsq]

What were your times at the track that weekend? I am curious. I drive an instructor friends miata with 225 hp at the rear wheel. I have followed street driven GT3s with established drivers and the car overheated. It is a FM 2 turbo kit, with all the goodies to cool it off, largest radiator, Spaal fans, ducting like no tomorrow, etc. It also depends on the ambient temps. Anything below about 80*, it takes until the afternoon to overheat. Then there is the reliability. I do not want issues like you stated you had with your car...

My reliability problems are minor and soon to be remedied (no more turbo bolts). I twas 90* and I only had to turn the fans on after a few laps in the afternoon, none in the morning even with the stock hood and broken ducting.

I don't know what lap times I was running. I was really slow on the 2nd session with 1:30's but got much, much faster at the end of the day when I finally learned to drive the car. I plan on running at Hallett soon though and of course I'll get times there. I've followed Schumacher's FXX without overheating on several occasions.

Does this car you've borrowed have ducting on the front of the radiator and coolant reroute?

[smartmx5]

My reliability problems are minor and soon to be remedied (no more turbo bolts). I twas 90* and I only had to turn the fans on after a few laps in the afternoon, none in the morning even with the stock hood and broken ducting.

I don't know what lap times I was running. I was really slow on the 2nd session with 1:30's but got much, much faster at the end of the day when I finally learned to drive the car. I plan on running at Hallett soon though and of course I'll get times there. I've followed Schumacher's FXX without overheating on several occasions.

Does this car you've borrowed have ducting on the front of the radiator and coolant reroute?

1:30's. That helps me out. I am at least five seconds faster in a spec miata.. The borrowed car has ducting on radiator and doesn't have a coolant reroute. I have read that on many posts and thought about it, but they too are still having overheating problems. At least the posts that have been posted.

[smartmx5]

I've followed Schumacher's FXX without overheating on several occasions.

I am sure you did.

[SirHustlerEsq]

1:30's. That helps me out. I am at least five seconds faster in a spec miata.. The borrowed car has ducting on radiator and doesn't have a coolant reroute. I have read that on many posts and thought about it, but they too are still having overheating problems. At least the posts that have been posted.

I don't think that was a clean lap either...it all came together and I pulled my head out. I ran 1:31's in this car with the 94whp motor and crummy suspension so there is a lot more to go in terms of driver.

Its pretty cool that you're within .5 seconds of the lap record set by the mx-5 cup champ in a $35k SM.

What car did you drive on the TDR track event? Did you run the advanced group in the last session?

I am sure you did.

yeah, I don't even get excited passing GT3's anymore, I only do "HPDE's" with retired F1 drivers now because I'm that bad ass.

[smartmx5]

I don't think that was a clean lap either...it all came together and I pulled my head out. I ran 1:31's in this car with the 94whp motor and crummy suspension so there is a lot more to go in terms of driver.

Its pretty cool that you're within .5 seconds of the lap record set by the mx-5 cup champ in a $35k SM.

What car did you drive on the TDR track event? Did you run the advanced group in the last session?



yeah, I don't even get excited passing GT3's anymore, I only do "HPDE's" with retired F1 drivers now because I'm that bad ass.

Actually I never said I was within .5 seconds of the lap record..... You stated you were in the 1:30s. My best time was a high 1:25 with most between 1:26.2 and 1:26.7. I love your sarcasm. It will keep you young. I drove the shine black Spec Miata with yellow roll cage and numbers.

[SirHustlerEsq]

1:30's. That helps me out. I am at least five seconds faster in a spec miata..

so lets see...1:35 (generosity) - :05 = 1.25.5....that's .7-tenths out from the SM lap record.

Actually I never said I was within .5 seconds of the lap record..... You stated you were in the 1:30s. My best time was a high 1:25 with most between 1:26.2 and 1:26.7. I love your sarcasm. It will keep you young. I drove the shine black Spec Miata with yellow roll cage and numbers.

So that's 5-seconds give or take 60%?

Do you realize that street-legal gt3rs are turning sub 1:20's? Not the racecar, the street car.

I can't help myself, I love internet lap time conversations. They always abound with facts and sad faces.

Oh and basing any #'s off someone's first day in a car with 3x the power, new suspension, brakes and everything else is pretty useless.

[smartmx5]

so lets see...1:35 (generosity) - :05 = 1.25.5....that's .7-tenths out from the SM lap record.

Let me help you with your math. Ok, Bueller, let's see...1:35 minus :05 (5 seconds) would be, about, oh let me see, 1:30.xx. Just in case you needed help.

You are totally missing my whole point. I am concerned about adding forced induction to my car and it overheating at the level of driving I am accustomed. You were ONLY driving in the 1:30s (did not state 1:30 or 1:31, or 1:32, etc.) by your own posting. I generously gave you the 1:30.xx to make my point. You then state the time you timed yourself was 1:31.xx . To me that is not where I would be driving my car. Another point, speaking of driving behind street driven GT3s, I was in my buddy's Turbo Miata. Don't be a douche bag. YOUR posts infer you are some driving god. I am not. I learn something everyday I get out on the track. My main point is, if am driving my SM in the 1:26s and I add FI, I should be well below that. Hence I would be driving well below YOUR times and would the car overheat?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!? And this track record, I have seen times at 1:24.475 in an SM and have been told someone even got into the 1:23s. Wouldn't it make sense that if I add forced induction to my car, I would probably be faster than my 1:26s? So do you have a constructive answer on the overheating issue or as you state, 'you love internet lap times'? I love the excuses of trying to shake your car out after you seemingly missed my point after you gave your two cents on overheating!!!!! I would guess you did not drive car as hard as I would have then!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!