Experts expect gas to top $4 a gallon shortly

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08-31-2005, 10:49 AM
altiain

Experts expect gas to top $4 a gallon shortly

Link to CNN Money article... :shock:

We filled Melissa's car up last night for $2.599/gallon, and I noticed it anywhere from $2.749 to $2.899 this morning for regular unleaded on my way in to work. Unfortunately, I chose not to fill the CRV up on the way home last night, and got stuck paying $2.75/gallon this morning. :sad:

This is ridiculous. The cost of my daily commute has gone up over twenty percent in the last three weeks, and it sounds like it could be up almost 100% within a few more weeks.

It's insane. Insane enough that, with almost 100 miles of daily commute, we're starting to contemplate trading the Accord in on a diesel or a hybrid or a super-efficient little four-banger. I'd be half-tempted to buy a motorcycle, but something tells me that 100 miles a day of North Dallas freeways and a motorcycle just won't mix.
08-31-2005, 10:50 AM
sammm

I just saw that article too. I paid $2.79 a gallon this morning after it was 'only' $2.58 the day before. What a freakin' racket!
08-31-2005, 10:56 AM
Treibenschnell

At what point do we say, "OK, enough is enough!" And what is there we can do? Complain? Not buy gas? This whole situation stinks...
08-31-2005, 11:38 AM
srivendel

This makes me love my 8 mile commute. Also makes me happy there's a DART bus that, if things keep getting worse, will take me one block from my house directly to the office.

Working in downtown Dallas has to have SOME advantage! :drink:

S.
08-31-2005, 11:44 AM
Treibenschnell

I wonder how many of these arrogant Plano/Frisco bastards will continue to drive their school buses... er, I mean, SUVs at $4 a gallon.
08-31-2005, 12:00 PM
sammm

Pointy Board Discussion

LINKIE
08-31-2005, 12:22 PM
srivendel

Here's an insightful :batman: post:

If it continues, perhaps we will see an in-migration back to large, dense cities with better public transit?

I could see it happening. Gasoline enabled suburbanization (along with the interstate highway act and general road building). Expensive enough gasoline could easily reverse that trend and put us in a similar situation as in Europe.

...or maybe we'll just see employers moving closer to their employees. Collin County then becomes a truly distinct metropolitan area from the rest of DFW.

PS: As someone who lives in the "inner ring" (inside 635) of Dallas, I hope Dallas employers stay put!

S.
08-31-2005, 12:25 PM
Kestrel

Quote:

Originally Posted by Treibenschnell

I wonder how many of these arrogant Plano/Frisco bastards will continue to drive their school buses... er, I mean, SUVs at $4 a gallon.

All of them. :rabbit:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Treibenschnell

At what point do we say, "OK, enough is enough!" And what is there we can do? Complain? Not buy gas? This whole situation stinks...

What are you suggesting we do? I'm sure if you have the answer, everyone would love to hear it. :tongue:
08-31-2005, 12:30 PM
Bell

Maybe this is just pure ignorance but I want to know who's still buying 93 octane? It almost makes me chuckle every time I'm at the pump.
08-31-2005, 12:32 PM
altiain

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bell

Maybe this is just pure ignorance but I want to know who's still buying 93 octane? It almost makes me chuckle every time I'm at the pump.

The prices I quoted above were for 89 octane. Every car I own runs on regular gas, but it's still killing me to put fuel in them, and they all get mid-20s mpg.
08-31-2005, 12:37 PM
POS Racing

Quote:

Originally Posted by Treibenschnell

I wonder how many of these arrogant Plano/Frisco bastards will continue to drive their school buses... er, I mean, SUVs at $4 a gallon.

How many of them actually have an alternative to their current vehicle? I’d bet not many, I’m lucky enough to have some spare cars lying around. But your average Joe and Jan public may not have any other options that the Tahoe they bought last year.

SUV hating isn’t going to change the price of gas.... :cat:
08-31-2005, 12:42 PM
sammm

Quote:

Originally Posted by POS Racing

SUV hating isn’t going to change the price of gas.... :cat:

No it isn't, but it's a big part of the problem with our country (especially this part of it). Who needs a Hummer, F-250/350 or such for commuting and/or buying groceries? It's ridiculous!
08-31-2005, 12:45 PM
Bell

Quote:

Originally Posted by altiain

The prices I quoted above were for 89 octane. Every car I own runs on regular gas, but it's still killing me to put fuel in them, and they all get mid-20s mpg.

I totally understand. I'm just predicting the day when we pull up to the gas pump and there are three buttons, all of them saying 89 octane. I assume a station has different tanks for each type of gas and there would come the time when it's best for sales to stock the cheap stuff. Guess you'd have to go out of your way to find the premium stuff if you needed it.

Right now we get the choice of Really Expensive Gas, Really, Really Expensive Gas, or Really, Really, Really Expensive Gas.
08-31-2005, 12:55 PM
srivendel

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bell

Maybe this is just pure ignorance but I want to know who's still buying 93 octane? It almost makes me chuckle every time I'm at the pump.

I am. The MSM requires 91+. We run 87 in the Saab.

S.
08-31-2005, 01:00 PM
POS Racing

Quote:

Originally Posted by srivendel

I am. The MSM requires 91+. We run 87 in the Saab.

S.

We are in the same 91+ boat with our '02, it Knocks like a mariachi band on crack if it doesn't get the good stuff.... :shock:
08-31-2005, 01:01 PM
Bell

Quote:

Originally Posted by srivendel

I am. The MSM requires 91+. We run 87 in the Saab.

S.

What is the mechanical necessity of higher octane? Not trying to be a punk, just really curious. I mean the manual tells me I should only go to the dealer for service but I don't.
08-31-2005, 01:05 PM
altiain

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bell

I assume a station has different tanks for each type of gas ...

Typically,gas stations have only two underground tanks. One for Regular (89, 87, or whatever their lowest grade of gas is), and one for Premium (91, 93, etc.) Any of the grades in between, and I've been to stations that had as a many as six grades of unleaded gasoline, are made on-demand at the pump, by mixing metered amounts of Regular and Premium.

For example, if the station has 89 and 93 octane tanks, and offers a 91 octane Mid-grade, the Mid-grade is made at the pump by metering 50% Regular, and 50% Premium. Simple as that.
08-31-2005, 01:07 PM
Treibenschnell

Quote:

Originally Posted by POS Racing

How many of them actually have an alternative to their current vehicle? I’d bet not many, I’m lucky enough to have some spare cars lying around. But your average Joe and Jan public may not have any other options that the Tahoe they bought last year.

SUV hating isn’t going to change the price of gas.... :cat:

I'm not hating on Joe and Jan public with their one vehicle... I'm talking about the affluent bastards in Frisco/Plano that are running their big vehicles.

If all you have is a Tahoe then, by all means, drive it. Believe me, if the situation was different, I'd love to have a F250 Crew Cab with the towing package... but the situation is what it is.

My question was at what point do we question the validity of the price increases? I know the reasons given...
08-31-2005, 01:10 PM
Treibenschnell

I own three vehicles... the VW (which uses nothing but premium) hasn't moved in days (and not just because the speedo sensor is dead) because I just don't care to pay that much for 93 octane.

If I owned a SUV it wouldn't be moving right now either...
08-31-2005, 01:14 PM
altiain

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bell

What is the mechanical necessity of higher octane? Not trying to be a punk, just really curious. I mean the manual tells me I should only go to the dealer for service but I don't.

Octane is a meausre of a fuel's resistance to pre-ignition. As fuel is compressed in a cylinder by the piston, the temperature of that fuel rises pretty much directly with pressure (thanks to the Ideal Gas Law). All fuels will ignite without need of a spark once they reach a certain temperature. Ignition of the fuel in a cylinder is a very controlled event, and pre-ignition, or ignition before the spark plug actually sparks, does all kinds of nasty things to the components in your engine, in addition to decreasing the power output of each combustion cycle.

Engine manufacturers design their engine duty cycles, spark plug ignition times, spark power, compression ratio, etc., based on an expected amount of octane. If you have fuel with too low an octane rating, it can pre-ignite. This pre-ignition is basically like having uncontrolled explosives going off in your combustion chambers, which puts enormous stress on engine components.

Conversely, putting in higher than required octane doesn't actually benefit you, nor will it increase your engine's power output (unless your car's ECM can electronically advance the spark timing and measure detonation events with knock sensors). In fact, it can cause damage, because higher octance fuel is actually harder to burn, leading to more unburned fuel in the exhaust, which raises emissions, actually robs power (less complete combustion in each power cycle), and shortens catalytic converter life, among other things.

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