Lscbmwcca de @ msr 3.1 4/28/12

Hoping to attend this DE, figured I'd try to scare-up a few more folks from this board. BMW puts on a great event.

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Spring '12 DE

LSC BMWCCA PresentsSpring '12 Driver's Education Weekend
Last day to register online: Tue Apr 24, 2012
2012 Lone Star Chapter Driver's Education Weekend
April 28th & 29th, 2012
Sign up!

Registration is now open for our first Driver Education Event of the 2012 season. This is not a racing school but rather a safe, high speed driving school, conducted on a race track under close supervision by experienced instructors. You will learn how to handle and control your vehicle at speeds not normally attained on public roads. This will help to prepare you for emergencies in normal driving. It will also allow you to explore your capabilities as a driver and those of your vehicle.
The event is open to all drivers (18 years and older) and all makes of cars. It is not a "BMW only" event. All cars and drivers will be subject to the same safety and inspection requirements. If you drive an open top car please refer to our convertible rules page @ http://www.lscbmwcca.org/hpde-convert_rules.html BEFORE REGISTERING & MAKING PAYMENT ONLINE!
REQUIRED: All student entrants in all run group levels MUST have a passenger seat with equal level restraints for both the driver and the instructor. IE). If the driver has a 5 point harness, the passenger must as well.
All registration will be handled online for this event. We anticipate filling up quickly, so register promptly! Your registration application will be reviewed by the Registrar and the Chief Driving Instructor (for proper classification) and if any changes are necessary you will be notified by email.
There will now be Novice, Intermediate, and Advanced. Advanced is for the most seasoned DE drivers and all run group assignments will be reviewed by the Chief Driving Instructor (CDI) and run adjustments may be made at his sole discretion.
For Questions regarding the event, contact Event Coordinator Steve Hodges @ [email protected]

When	Sat Apr 28 – Sun Apr 29, 2012
Where	Motorsports Ranch Cresson (map)

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They won't take you. Your car doesn't meet their tech. They are strict about the two inch rule on bars.


As per their page about convertibles linked in your post:

Additionally, the car must be equipped with a 5 or 6 point harnesses and arm restraints for driver and passenger. This means you need to install a 5 or 6 point harness for you and the instructor. Arm restraints are highly recommended for you and your instructor. Finally, the roll bar must clear the occupants' helmets by 2" in a straight line from the top of the roll bar to the front fender line (which assumes that the windshield collapsed).

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Originally Posted by Nails

They won't take you. Your car doesn't meet their tech. They are strict about the two inch rule on bars.


As per their page about convertibles linked in your post:

Additionally, the car must be equipped with a 5 or 6 point harnesses and arm restraints for driver and passenger. This means you need to install a 5 or 6 point harness for you and the instructor. Arm restraints are highly recommended for you and your instructor. Finally, the roll bar must clear the occupants' helmets by 2" in a straight line from the top of the roll bar to the front fender line (which assumes that the windshield collapsed).

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Lol, OK. I bet they'll get a lot of quality drivers considering no Miata owner can show up and no Miata owner will ever teach these guys anything. We are glorious, behold us.

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Originally Posted by Nails

They won't take you. Your car doesn't meet their tech. They are strict about the two inch rule on bars.


As per their page about convertibles linked in your post:

Additionally, the car must be equipped with a 5 or 6 point harnesses and arm restraints for driver and passenger. This means you need to install a 5 or 6 point harness for you and the instructor. Arm restraints are highly recommended for you and your instructor. Finally, the roll bar must clear the occupants' helmets by 2" in a straight line from the top of the roll bar to the front fender line (which assumes that the windshield collapsed).

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Lol, OK. I bet they'll get a lot of quality drivers considering no Miata owner can show up and no Miata owner will ever teach these guys anything. We are glorious, behold us.

I do meet the 2 inch rule with my new seat and my HT. :)

Sayonara, beeches!

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Originally Posted by mr brg

Lol, OK. I bet they'll get a lot of quality drivers considering no Miata owner can show up and no Miata owner will ever teach these guys anything. We are glorious, behold us.

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Do I really need to say it?

This looks fun. Not big on the 2 day events though.

How do they do there run sessions? Is it like Drivers Edge?

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Originally Posted by OZMDD

I do meet the 2 inch rule with my new seat and my HT. :)

Sayonara, beeches!

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You get 2 seats for the car since the rule states occupants as in you and your instructor?

Funny how a fiberglass hardtop nullifies the need for a roll-bar. Fiberglass FTW!!!

Looked promising until I read the fine print. Dammit, that would've been good timing for a track day.

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Originally Posted by OZMDD

I do meet the 2 inch rule with my new seat and my HT. :)

Sayonara, beeches!

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Mike, you might want to reread those convertible rules.

Here are the old rules:

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These are the rules that have been set in place by our club in accordance with the BMW CCA national standards. Every open topped car must be equipped with roll over protection. Additionally, the car must be equipped with a 5 or 6 point harnesses and arm restraints for driver and passenger. This means you need to install a 5 or 6 point harness and arm restraints for you and the instructor. Finally, the roll bar must clear the occupants' helmets by 2" in a straight line from the top of the roll bar to the top of the windshield. This will be measured before going out on track.
Using a factory hardtop in conjunction with factory rollover protection is also acceptable in lieu of harnesses and arm restraints. The top must be made by the manufacturer of the car and be of METAL construction. The top must also be attached using factory hardware. This will be visually confirmed.
Note, BMW CCA strongly recommends (but does not require) a taller roll bar that clears the occupants' heads by 2" in a straight line from the top of the roll bar to the front fender line (which assumes that the windshield collapsed).

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So, under the old rules you wouldn’t have passed, because the factory NC hard top is not metal.

Here are the new rules:

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These are the rules that have been set in place by our club in accordance with the BMW CCA operations manual minimum standards for driver’s education events. Every open topped car must be equipped with fixed roll over protection (pop up roll over protection that is standard on many 3 series convertibles is not acceptable). Additionally, the car must be equipped with a 5 or 6 point harnesses and arm restraints for driver and passenger. This means you need to install a 5 or 6 point harness for you and the instructor. Arm restraints are highly recommended for you and your instructor. Finally, the roll bar must clear the occupants' helmets by 2" in a straight line from the top of the roll bar to the front fender line (which assumes that the windshield collapsed).
Any car that is a convertible, targa, or t-top will need to have its tech inspection done at our sponsor- Classic BMW in Plano. You will need to bring your helmet to this inspection to ensure it meets the 2” rule. Classic BMW of Plano charges $99.95 for this inspection, but also includes a brake flush which is also required within 6 months prior to the event. I would strongly suggest you work with me prior to the event to get this worked out. If you show up on the day of the event and something isn't perfect, you won't be allowed to run and will not be given a refund. Please contact Bruce Heersink with any questions.

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In the new rules, there is no allowance to bypass the helmet clearance rules with a hard top, factory or not. I highly doubt that your helmeted head is 2” below a straight line from the top of the factory roll hoops to the front fender line (NOT the windshield) if you can still see over the dash.

Second, you have to have 5 point harnesses for both driver and passenger. Where are you attaching the shoulder belts to?

Let us know how your inspection goes at Classic BMW. I’m curious to hear the results.

In other words, bring a coupe/sedan or don't show up :(

Lotsa Bitter Betty's here. Thanks for all the effort you put into trying to be a downer. Slow at work today?::Bum::

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Originally Posted by OZMDD

Lotsa Bitter Betty's here. Thanks for all the effort you put into trying to be a downer. Slow at work today?::Bum::

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Every day!

P.S. how are you posting all day in the middle of class?

Mind Bullets.

No refunds. Not trying to be a downer just trying to save you money.

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Originally Posted by Nails

No refunds. Not trying to be a downer just trying to save you money.

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What Nails said. Not trying to be a downer, just trying to save you money/hassle/time.

I'll be a Bitter Betty -- you suck! ;)

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Originally Posted by ken o

Do I really need to say it?

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lol @ Lord Helmet

If I can figure out when to study for finals AND get parts installed in the Genesis, I plan to have a fine time at the DE that weekend. Thanks for reminding me why I have a pig heavy hardtop Miata in my driveway, Mike!

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Originally Posted by altiain

What Nails said. Not trying to be a downer, just trying to save you money/hassle/time.

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Trying and failing at humor. Stoopid emotionless keyboard. New rules are really over-the-top, even by BMW standards. No wonder they don't bother to post their DE's on the track calendar.

I finally got a seat below the broomstick test and a HT, and now this. This is why autox>track.