Advice: suspension upgrade

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10-05-2009, 11:42 AM
MoonieGT

Advice: suspension upgrade

I'm trying to get a plan together for suspension upgrades. My '91 is completely stock right now. I've never done any Auto-X or Track Days but I hope to do some in the future. I'm thinking I might be able to do 1-2 Auto-x and/or 1-2 track days a year (after I get a roll bar of course). In other words most of the time will be spent just driving around town for fun etc.

I'm thinking spending big $$ (Tein flex etc.) on suspension for a car that won't make it to the track very often is not the best plan (and I'm on a small budget). What does everyone recommend for a car that will be on the street for 98% of the time?

I'm considering keeping the stock springs (the car sits prettly low now IMHO, ~13" front ~13.5" rear) and upgrading the shocks and sways. New rims and tires to follow (Maybe konig feathers). Would stock springs, KYB-AGX, with FM sways be an affordable setup for the street?
10-05-2009, 12:00 PM
jrj512

You might want to spend the money on Koni Sports (yellow) instead of KYBs. Everyone that has tried both comes back stating that the Konis are worth the extra dough. I really liked the FM front sway on my NA. I am now using the RB hollow, but the FM was quite good. It is rare that you will need a rear sway beyond the stock bar, so save your money.
10-05-2009, 12:15 PM
OZMDD

"Would stock springs, KYB-AGX, with FM sways be an affordable setup for the street?"

Yes. I had essentially the exact same setup on my 92, and it worked well for autox.

Stock springs will roll more than stiffer aftermarkets, but they are pretty decent on a Miata. Plus, the set-up you describe allows you to stay in "Stock" class if you don't do the rear Sway bar. Also, you are supposed to stick with factory wheel size, but you'd be fine at the occasional local autoX if you just let the other competitors know what you're running. Its a courtesy thing, since you won't have a significant performance advantage. You'd even be ok doing the same thing with the rear sway, but many Miata drivers claim the rear sway bar isn't terribly helpful to upgrade unless you're making significant cahnges to the car.
10-05-2009, 01:24 PM
OZMDD

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrj512

You might want to spend the money on Koni Sports (yellow) instead of KYBs. Everyone that has tried both comes back stating that the Konis are worth the extra dough. I really liked the FM front sway on my NA. I am now using the RB hollow, but the FM was quite good. It is rare that you will need a rear sway beyond the stock bar, so save your money.

Listen to him. He knows of what he speaks.:burnrubr:
10-05-2009, 01:40 PM
MoonieGT

I guess I'll save for the konis and a front bar.

I should get the front bar only from FM (which is thicker than the front bar that they package with the rear correct?

Also, what after market spring goes well with the konis?
10-05-2009, 02:02 PM
jrj512

Quote:

Originally Posted by MoonieGT

I should get the front bar only from FM (which is thicker than the front bar that they package with the rear correct?

That is correct.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MoonieGT

Also, what after market spring goes well with the konis?

I will let someone else chine in here on the best springs for the Konis, but I have heard good things about the FM springs. However, keep in mind that using non-stock springs will take you out of SCCA stock class. Since you only plan to attend a few events per year, I doubt that really matters you you. It also would not have any effect in your classing for NTAXS and BMW autocross events. For the most part, unless SCCA class-competitiveness is important to you, then modify the car how you want without any regard to SCCA classing.
10-05-2009, 02:04 PM
gabkwong

Quote:

Originally Posted by MoonieGT

Also, what after market spring goes well with the konis?

You can NOT touch those springs if you want to stay in stock class! However, if you want to take it out to the track, you may want stiffer springs. For now, you can do OK w the Koni yellow and FM front sway.
10-05-2009, 02:05 PM
POS Racing

Goodwin Racing says:

Quote:

Miata shocks come in many flavors but these are our favorite Miata shocks. The most popular Miata shock for the last decade with Miata street users, autocrossers and track drivers alike. These Koni Miata shocks always seem to work just a little better than the KYBs. Unlike the KYB's you don't get that "squish-squish" noise from the valving with these. As a bonus these Miata shocks include a three position spring perch that can be used to lower your Miata almost an inch even with stock springs.

I've had both and I like the Koni's more better!

YMMV

Link - http://www.good-win-racing.com/Mazda...on/Shocks.html
10-05-2009, 02:08 PM
MoonieGT

Class competiveness is not important for now. My goal is to improve handling and enjoy the car. I'll try the Koni/stock spring combo first and see how it goes...

Thanks
10-05-2009, 02:28 PM
Miatamaniac92

I have the following setup:
Koni Yellows (highest perch settings)
Stock Springs
FCM (don't remember which bumpstops off hand)
FM grey sways
RB rear brace
FM butterfly/ladder brace

The front dropped quite a bit even with the stock springs, though the front lip doesn't scrape too badly.

I think it's a great compromise for track/street driving. It's not the smoothest ride but it's not mind jarring like some of the dropped Miata's I've been in.

Pics on the track:
http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g1...SC_3414-vi.jpg

Chris
10-05-2009, 03:54 PM
gabkwong

Sorry, off subject a little. Is that right that the Koni yellow for NA has 3 different spring perches and only 1 for NB. I don't remember mine (99) has more than 1.
10-05-2009, 07:35 PM
Miatamaniac92

I think mine have 5.

Chris
10-05-2009, 09:57 PM
Nails

Very, very cool pic Miatamaniac92!

I don't know NA suspensions that well but I do know your car is as only as good as the four contact patches. Like a stereo is as good as it's speakers, a car is as good as it's tires. If it were me, I would decide rims and tires first before changing the rest. That's what I did with my NC.
10-06-2009, 07:02 AM
MoonieGT

Would you have changed rims and tires on your NC first if your shocks were completely dead?

Maybe rims and tires should be first because the tires that came on the car are almost five years old and the valve stems are surrounded by little cracks....
10-06-2009, 08:43 AM
redmenace

Quote:

Originally Posted by MoonieGT

I've never done any Auto-X or Track Days but I hope to do some in the future.

If the shocks are blown, replace 'em. If the tires are shot, replace 'em. Otherwise, learn to drive the hell out of it in stock form first. Then you'll actually be able to FEEL the difference that mods make -- and isn't THAT the best return on that investment?

JMO, etc.
10-06-2009, 10:25 AM
Miatamaniac92

Quote:

Originally Posted by MoonieGT

Would you have changed rims and tires on your NC first if your shocks were completely dead?

Maybe rims and tires should be first because the tires that came on the car are almost five years old and the valve stems are surrounded by little cracks....

If the budget is tight, I would put an emphasis on tires. What wheels and tires are on there now?

Also, if you watch eBay and the Classifieds it's possible to find TCB deals on a set of Koni Yellows and other suspension components.

Chris
10-06-2009, 11:30 AM
MoonieGT

The stock 14's are are on there now with some non-sport tires... I forget what is on there but they are not very grippy on the street (which can be fun).
10-06-2009, 11:58 AM
SirHustlerEsq

I've run 4 set-ups now between two cars and the tein flex win hands down in terms of drivability on the track and comfort on the street. There are other options out there, but the Koni yellows are the only one that's cheaper.
10-22-2009, 07:46 PM
2004Busa

I feel like I am going to get hung for posting this but have you heard of Raceland coilovers? Let me add that I have Tokico blues with HKS springs on them and it rides pretty good but as soon as I get those coilovers they're gone.
10-23-2009, 11:24 AM
MoonieGT

Ok I'm kind of currious about those...

For $240, would they be worse than the 18 year old blown shocks that are on my '91? Maybe the ride will break my teeth... but I'm thinking they would be a good place holder so that I don't have to ride around on blown shocks until I've got ~$1k to do the suspension the right way...
10-23-2009, 11:34 AM
POS Racing

Quote:

Originally Posted by MoonieGT

Ok I'm kind of currious about those...

For $240, would they be worse than the 18 year old blown shocks that are on my '91?

OK I'm lost $240 for what? :confused:

Link Please!
10-23-2009, 11:37 AM
Rogue

I have a set of those blue Tokico's.
I have driven Miata's with 150k plus on OEM's that were about the same.
I wouldn't give them away.
10-23-2009, 11:45 AM
juxt3r

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2004Busa

I feel like I am going to get hung for posting this but have you heard of Raceland coilovers? Let me add that I have Tokico blues with HKS springs on them and it rides pretty good but as soon as I get those coilovers they're gone.

There's a rather extended thread on cr.net from someone who's using the Raceland units: here

I'm extremely skeptical about any full coilover setup that costs less than a typical set of shocks (or springs, for that matter). I'll be sticking to some of the larger name brands when the time comes.
10-23-2009, 12:07 PM
MoonieGT

Quote:

Originally Posted by juxt3r

There's a rather extended thread on cr.net from someone who's using the Raceland units: here

I'm extremely skeptical about any full coilover setup that costs less than a typical set of shocks (or springs, for that matter). I'll be sticking to some of the larger name brands when the time comes.

I dont doubt that the raceland's are not a quality setup, but are they worse than 18 year old shocks? The answer is probably so or everyone would suggest them...

I just want to ditch the stockers and don't have the funds for springs and shocks yet :)

http://www.racelandus.com/p-66-racel...da-mx5-na.aspx
10-23-2009, 01:04 PM
Miatamaniac92

Quote:

Originally Posted by MoonieGT

I dont doubt that the raceland's are not a quality setup, but are they worse than 18 year old shocks? The answer is probably so or everyone would suggest them...

I just want to ditch the stockers and don't have the funds for springs and shocks yet :)

http://www.racelandus.com/p-66-racel...da-mx5-na.aspx

Tire situation still the same?

Chris
10-23-2009, 01:27 PM
POS Racing

Quote:

Originally Posted by MoonieGT

http://www.racelandus.com/p-66-racel...da-mx5-na.aspx

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racland's Website

This product is intended to be used only in race cars and or show vehicles. The Raceland coil over kit is not to be installed in vehicles driven on public roads.

Really?? :confused:

Not for vehicles driven on public roads????
10-23-2009, 01:40 PM
jrj512

I know from experience that a good shock will make a stiff spring ride as good as stock -- come ride in my car and guess the spring rates. If that statement is true, then does a crappy shock make any spring ride like crap? If that is also true, then don't buy crappy shocks. I know nothing of Raceland shocks.
10-23-2009, 01:59 PM
Rogue

Quote:

Originally Posted by MoonieGT

I just want to ditch the stockers and don't have the funds for springs and shocks yet :)

Then buy good shocks. You just can't afford the slammage.

Its overated anyway. :D
10-23-2009, 02:12 PM
driftdevil

1 Attachment(s)

If your looking for a good budget setup that works good for daily and track and has a decent stance look at Pro-kit springs and AGXs. That is what I had on mine and it worked great. And with 15s you'll have a nice stance not too low but low enough.

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