Please don't give your teen a performance car

The recent crash in Princeton that killed two 17-year olds (so far) after a 4am high-speed crash with 7 kids in a 5-seat car is tragic. It also reminds me that cars may be much safer than they ever, but teens still have no business driving a 260-hp turbo Mazdaspeed3. I haven't done the exact math, but I'd wager the power-to-weight on the MS3 rivals the Mustang 5.0's that were what the rich kids got back in the late 80's, with similar deadly results.

Tragic, and maybe somewhat preventable (at least it would be a slower crash in a normal Mazda3)

This reminds me of the story a while back when some kids snuck into a runway at a small airport and launched their dad's new M5 off the end killing all the passengers. Kids that want to do dumb stuff will still find a way to get themselves killed but it's also way more tempting in a fast car.

Meh. We managed to stuff seven kids in an '83 RX-7. Hurt like f%&$ when the hatch glass slammed down on my legs (which were hanging out of the hatch) as the driver took it over a yump through the river bottoms, but we all managed to survive.

Kids will do stupid shit, and they'll find a way to do that stupid shit whether it's in a high performance car or an old Tercel.

^^^

This is true. I had a 5.0 in high school and didn't really do any stupid shit in it till I was college.

OTOH, one of my high school friends had an ancient, slow-as-balls Subaru GL automatic that she used to scare the living piss out of anyone who dared to ride with her. I learned my lesson after she went screaming through Bluffview late one night (near Midway and NW Hwy), slid the car into somebody's front yard, and took out multiple bags of trash along with a mailbox. I won't even mention the 4th of July cornfield excursion earlier that summer. And we don't need to talk about jumping the railroad tracks on Lakeland down by the Arboretum... suffice to say that it was a lot more exhilarating if you held the doors open.

Ummm the guy driving the car was 19 so not exactly a kid anymore.

It sucks and it is sad but it has been going on for years and years....

Also Texas has changed the rules since I was a teen now the rules are a bit more stringent to try and keep these kids a bit safer.

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Originally Posted by Texas DPS Website

Once you have held your learner’s permit for six months, and you’ve completed your 20 hours of behind-the-wheel training, it’s time to make a trip to the DPS and take your road test. Successfully pass this test and Phase Two, with your intermediate license, begins.

Restricted Driving with an Intermediate License
With your Intermediate License, you can now drive solo without supervision, but there are a few restrictions:

You can’t drive between midnight and 5 a.m.
You can’t have more than one passenger younger than 21 who is not a family member.
You can have no wireless communication, hands-free or not, unless it is an emergency.

Once you have one year of safe driving under your belt with your intermediate license, or if you turn 18, the state GDL restrictions will be lifted. You’re now a fully licensed driver.

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If they were drunk and/or stoned it wouldn't really matter what they were driving, does it?

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Originally Posted by sammm

If they were drunk and/or stoned it wouldn't really matter what they were driving, does it?

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Even that isn't a requirement as we lost an Allen High School senior recently who was texting and driving in her new-ish Accord. This isn't a teen thing either. I think we've all been guilty of being distracted while driving. Whether it's texting, talking on the phone, eating, drinking or monkeying with the radio. It only takes a moment to change a life. As much as I love to drive, we could save thousands of lives if we can just take the human factor out of the equation. I'm sure we will see self-driving cars in the next 5-10 years. I think it will solve lots of problems. Inattentive driving, drunk driving, speeding, tailgating, timid driving and road rage to name a few.

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Originally Posted by black roadster

As much as I love to drive, we could save thousands of lives if we can just take the human factor out of the equation.

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...and you'd save yourself so many spins on the track!

But seriously... that's what PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION is for. I'm sorry, but every day I see some a$$hole weaving down LBJ that seriously can't put the phone down for 10 effing minutes and get where they're going. I really do want to go all vigilante on these people and just run them off onto the shoulder as a friendly reminder that they need to pay attention on the road or else bad things will happen. Inattentive and timid driving generally causes tailgating, speeding and unchecked gorilla aggression in normal drivers.

I don't want to live in a world where I have to share the road with self-driving cars. Human factor or not, what happens when the Google car decides to reboot at 70 mph on Central? Who's at fault when that POS rear-ends me? Who do I yell at when it cuts me off in traffic?

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Originally Posted by trickyrix

I don't want to live in a world where I have to share the road with self-driving cars. Human factor or not, what happens when the Google car decides to reboot at 70 mph on Central? Who's at fault when that POS rear-ends me? Who do I yell at when it cuts me off in traffic?

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While the Google cars are only in Beta Test mode, they have have driven 500,000 miles cumulatively in three years with no incidents. There was one incident two years ago when a Google car hit another parked vehicle but a human was controlling the car at the time. lol

Just like ABS, traction control and stability control, the computers can be more consistent and smoother driver's their human counterparts. I don't think it's a mater of if but when we have autonomous cars. Your comments about all the asshat driver's out there confirm my assertion that autonomous cars will be safer as computers are more consistent and don't have emotions or distractions. I'd bet the real challenge to autonomous vehicle engineers is dealing with the other human drivers out there.

I imagine it will start slowly like dedicated autonomous freeway lanes and virtually connected car trains which Volvo has already implemented successfully in Europe. There will also have to be all the legal issues answered as you suggested when an autonomous vehicle does make an error in judgement.

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Originally Posted by trickyrix

I don't want to live in a world where I have to share the road with self-driving cars.

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I don't particularly like the idea either, but it is an interesting problem that, as a software engineer, I would love the chance to work on. There would have to be an on/off switch though. I dread the idea of not being able to drive but, instead, being forced to "ride."

They are getting better for sure:
http://www.gizmag.com/stanford-audi-tts-autonomous-car-thunderhill/24957/

As a human being, I can adapt and avoid trouble. I don't trust a computer to do the same. If I want to ride along and pay no attention, I'll take DART. Besides, if the driverless car solution involves a huge installation of infrastructure so we can have "car trains," why don't we just take real trains? I doubt the cost-benefit works out at all when you're talking about dedicated car-train lanes.

Also, just like ABS and the suite of stability nannies, computers break. I'm pretty sure a computer could handle driving down a lightly trafficked road while staying in a lane, but I don't want that thing running up behind me when I have to make a panic stop to avoid running over box of puppies or something. And what of the liability issues I pointed out? Is the human obligated to be a backup? What about the idiots who will claim that they didn't know they were supposed to pay attention - the ones who thought that Google Jesus would take them in a warm embrace and provide for them from cradle to grave? At some point, human drivers and robot drivers will have to interact, I'm pretty sure of that. And that's where it'll get ugly - with Google denying responsibility and directing you to call customer service in Bombay to resolve your technical issue.

Regarding asshat drivers, I just want them off the road, and I'm happy to help as long as it's okay for me to nudge them in the driver's door. How hard is it to pound into someone's head that it's NOT OKAY to dick with your phone while you're driving? I'm in the camp that says talking on the phone is probably just fine while driving, but when you have to keep your eyes off the road and concentrate on texting or typing in that pesky BangBus web address, you need to need to wait for the next red light or just pull off into a parking lot.

Short of a friendly tap on the bumper, or the casual "hey, how are ya?" of a D-cell battery cracking a windshield, I'd like to know what I can do at a grassroots level to set these people straight.

Man... I think we just totally ran this thread off into the bar ditch. :punchout:

Too soon, Rick. :) I didn't say that you couldn't do stupid shit in an econobox or accord, but its a whole lot less exciting than doing it in a turbo MS3, and as many of us know from personal experience, it feels faster than it really is in a slower car. Maybe a 50 mph off and some broken bones instead of a 100mph off and a body count. I just imagine how stupid I was at 18/19 in a VW fastback or my 76 Caddy, and multiply that by whatever factor a performance designed hot hatch with a stick, a spooling turbo and good suspension at 4am in the presence of potential pussy... I'd have no chance to resist either.

We all do stupid things in our youth. Some us get lucky and some do not. I do agree that we should use common seance when buying our kids a car.
Tiffany - VW Cab
Natalie - Mazda 6
emily - Civic
Gregory- Jeep Grand Cherakee
Christopher - my 89 Miata (I hate to say it but he gits it next year)

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Originally Posted by bnordin

We all do stupid things in our youth. Some us get lucky and some do not. I do agree that we should use common seance when buying our kids a car.

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Now you tell me!
https://scontent-a-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/...92869881_n.jpg
Teach these kids to drive a car I mean really drive a car!

Don't just buy the biggest car you can because you don't have time to spend time with your kid teaching them to drive.

Heck and in cases like Black Roadster's where you can't drive there is always additional training options like -> http://www.totaldrivingexperience.co...ls/skillsteen/ or http://www.tirerack.com/features/mot...t_survival.jsp

I agree, young drivers should not have high performance cars. But ...
maybe its just being a parent, why where high schoolers out driving around at 4am?
Nothing good can come of that.

I know kids can play the "I'm staying at so and so's tonight" game, but I certainly spent plenty of time trying to make if very difficult for my kids to be out at that time of night.

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Originally Posted by OZMDD

The recent crash in Princeton that killed two 17-year olds (so far) after a 4am high-speed crash with 7 kids in a 5-seat car is tragic.

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News said the two kids who passed were thrown from the vehicle and died at the scene....

Read more: http://www.myfoxdfw.com/story/239341...#ixzz2kOWzyPPp

My first car was an '87 VW Jetta. I remember racing my buddies 323 across the Rowlett road bridge side by side at 100mph. Kids don't need performance cars to do stupid shit.

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Originally Posted by BigDmiata

My first car was an '87 VW Jetta. I remember racing my buddies 323 across the Rowlett road bridge side by side at 100mph. Kids don't need performance cars to do stupid shit.

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What he said. I had an '85 Mazda 626 liftback (digital dash and power oscillating air vents FTW!) in high school. I used to race a buddy's 320i on the freeway, and got that ~90hp four door up to an indicated 126 MPH on at least one occasion, with three other idiots riding (egging me) along.

You don't need power to be stupid. Not when you're young and indestructible.

My parents didn't give me a HiPo car, they didn't give me any car.
Told me to get a job, which I did, and bought my own damn car.
I was 15, bought my 1st car when I was 16.

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Originally Posted by Rogue

My parents didn't give me a HiPo car, they didn't give me any car.
Told me to get a job, which I did, and bought my own damn car.
I was 15, bought my 1st car when I was 16.

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Same here. Rode my 10-speed to work until I could buy my first car. A 1974 Ford Capri for $318.00 with a bad clutch. Had the 2.0 4-banger out of the Pinto and a 4-speed manual. I loved that car! Wish I could find another in decent shape. Drop a small V8 in it or even a 1.8 Miata motor with a Rotrex!

Worked a paper route. Bought a '74 F-250 with a 360 FE for $300. Had floorboard AC. LOL. I could only afford gas sporadically though.

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Originally Posted by trickyrix

...and you'd save yourself so many spins on the track!

But seriously... that's what PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION is for. I'm sorry, but every day I see some a$$hole weaving down LBJ that seriously can't put the phone down for 10 effing minutes and get where they're going. I really do want to go all vigilante on these people and just run them off onto the shoulder as a friendly reminder that they need to pay attention on the road or else bad things will happen. Inattentive and timid driving generally causes tailgating, speeding and unchecked gorilla aggression in normal drivers.

I don't want to live in a world where I have to share the road with self-driving cars. Human factor or not, what happens when the Google car decides to reboot at 70 mph on Central? Who's at fault when that POS rear-ends me? Who do I yell at when it cuts me off in traffic?

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Oh come on... "Normal" drivers somehow always manage to rein in the gorilla!!!

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Originally Posted by Rogue

My parents didn't give me a HiPo car, they didn't give me any car.
Told me to get a job, which I did, and bought my own damn car.
I was 15, bought my 1st car when I was 16.

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I got lucky... my sister gave me my first car. A POS Mercedes 300SD Turbo (diesel). Very high performance... 0-60 in 22 seconds ::Banana:: I sold it for $800.

I managed 115 in my mom's Mitsubishi Outlander on the 30 bridge one time. That was about the speed the car started shaking and I stopped out of fear haha.

95ish in the Malibu, 90ish in the xD, and around 85 in the Miata (terrifying, if I'm honest).

Even those of us that bought our own cars can buy ones with too much powah ;)

I learned to drive stick in the mountains in a Fiat Uno... but the first car I bought and paid for was a 1970 240z with a 3x2 weber setup... no heat, no ac, rusted out floorboards, pleather seats out of a fiesta with lap belts only and an idiot behind the wheel. I made it from Wichita to Duncan, OK in a little under 2 hours...

My first car was a 92 Acura Legend, not exactly a performance car but 200 hp. Totaled it on 635 in spectacular fashion. My kid will be getting something as slow or slower than a Miata.

The only safety feature that really works.....this in the rear view mirror.

https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/i...NctmQJNu0uVj5Q

That didn't work on me,…………….but the judge in front of me did.

I bought my own car that was a 76 280z. Still miss that car, but damn it was fun!

95 Nissan Maxima. Was a great starter car... til a big truck ran me off into a ditch.
Size doesn't really matter in Texas people will move into whatever lane they want. Just have to drive smart.

My son will be getting a truck or SUV. 14 years from now when he can drive lol.

A carload of teenagers going anywhere at 4AM is already a problem IMHO. When did that ever turn into a good thing?

I have twin boys. They are 14, but I've been telling then for years that there are 2 levels of DL requirements. There are the state requirements. Then there are Dad's requirements!

I had a friend who wasn't allowed to have more than one other person in the car until he was 20 hahaha

My dad did it right, no rules other than you pay for your own speeding tickets and resulting insurance increases. Then gave me a rusted out POS that none of my friends would ever want to be seen in. We lived far enough out that my friends never wanted to drive out to get me so I always just met them. It worked out pretty well.

My first car was a ford fairmont futura (Mustang Chassis with the 302 V8 ). It would not do 70.

Fastest I have been is 100 in my Wifes Solara Convertable V-6. Suprisingly smooth.
And 110 in my old 3500 Cummins Diesel.

In High School, a friend of mine rolled his parents Ford Tarus SHO on a country road. The moron was speeding and swerving to show off how well it handled to other kids. Luckily only minor injuries for all involved. I was not in the car.