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So what do run for an alignment? I want to get the POS aligned but figure stock isn't good for Autocross, and "Lanny's" appears to be just a step up from stock specs. I had it done at a local shop to Mike Kuhn (Famous now retired Miata Repair guy) a while ago, but I have no ideal how they set it, but I did get to sit in the car.
In advance I appreciate your help!
I'm sure you've seen this link on the :batman: board.
http://www.miata.net/garage/align.html
I called some of the Arlington Firestone's a few months back and was asking about their "Lifetime Alignment". IIRC one of them told me I could sit in the car, provide my own specs and still get the Lifetime deal. I think the cost was $120-130. An alignment has been on my to do list. Anyone else interested in the Firestone deal?
UPDATE: The Firestone below will let you sit in the car, provide your own specs and get the lifetime deal for $139.99. I spoke with Mike.
Firestone Tire & Service Center
1233 Melbourne Rd
Hurst TX, 76053
(817) 595-1866
Sorry, but I wouldn't trust a Firestone shop...ever.
That 'Pederson's' Shop in Ft. Worth did my alignment last year. I was asked if I wanted the 'extreme' race alignment or the 'mild' race alignment. I'm going back this year for the 'extreme.' I believe the cost was in the $70 range, although I was not allowed to sit in the car....bring your own :pig: . Altiain has recommended this shop previously, and I think JRW just took his car there last week.
There seem to be a number of good alignment techs in Firestone shops around the area. The one in Richardson near Jupiter also allows you to sit in the car, but I lost a $5 bet with the tech when he aligned it without me in it and it was dead on my specs after I sat in it...
For between $119 and $159 depending on what promos they're running, it's nice to be able to get an alignment every few months for just the time involved in going to the shop... YMMV
I generally didn't trust Firestone shops either... However, the 3 times I've been there so far, I've seen them give awfully good advice to people with broken cars, even when said advice cost them an easy sale...
So what Specs are you guys running???
Camber f/r: -1.2/-1.8
Caster f: 4.5
Total Toe in f/r: 0/.25"
Next time it goes in, I'm going to decrease the rear toe in (to .125" total), as I'm having less and less trouble keeping the car pointed in a straight line and that should help rotate things a bit.
I'm probably also going to shift toward about .125" total toe out in the front.
That's good.Quote:
For between $119 and $159 depending on what promos they're running, it's nice to be able to get an alignment every few months for just the time involved in going to the shop... YMMV
The spec's of my last visit:
Front:
camber...-0.7 deg
caster..... 5.0 deg
toe..........0.08 deg
Rear:
camber.....-1.8 deg
toe............0.15 deg
Pedersons will give a print-out of each corners' 'before, after, and specified range...'
This is from memory, the specs are in my car.
Front -1.5 degrees camber
3.6 degrees castor
a little toe out
Rear -2.0
close to zero toe
apparently -1.5 is not enough for Hoosiers.
Just keep in mind the bigger the spilt front to rear in camber the looser the car will be...
JRW, were those the "before" or "after" specs? I know lugnutjon has less than those camber #s (more like -1.0/-1.5), yet he's got almost 25 runs on his S04s and they look better than my V700s do after half as many runs.Quote:
Originally Posted by JRW
Bzzzt! Wrong answer! :wink:Quote:
Originally Posted by Majik
Actually, running a larger front to rear camber split (all other things equal) will generally make the car understeer more. A smaller front-to-rear split will make the car looser (more prone to oversteer).
My last alignment:
Front
-1.5 camber
4.5 caster
0 toe
Rear
-2.0 camber
1/8" total toe-in
I'm going to try 0 toe in the rear and an 1/8" of toe-out up front at the next alignment with the big front bar to help turn-in and decrease steady-state understeer, which I'm trying to dial out now (semi-successfully) with tire pressures.
I've liked Peterson's Automotive in Haltom City in the past, but if Firestone in Hurst is really willing to honor lifetime alignment on custom specs (and give me something in writing to verify such), then I might give them a try next week. Sammmm, do you remember who you talked to up there? Maybe we can swing a "Team Cheap Bastard" discounted rate if we can line up enough interested people. :thumleft:
His name was Mike. I already tried the group discount pitch and he wasn't interested. He said the $139 was already discounted $30. If we have enough interested parties I'll be glad to pitch it to him again! :wink:Quote:
Originally Posted by altiain
I'm interested in a party! :lol: I mean I'm an interested party! :wink:Quote:
Originally Posted by sammm
Those are after specs for me.
BUT the rear camber was -1.5 degrees and the front was about the same.
I had too much toe out up front and too much toe in the rear.
I am still not convinced there is not a problem with 16 inch Hoosiers. The fact that I have a depth indicator touching the cord showing on the outside edge. For cord to show you should not be able to find any depth indicator.
See, that should teach you guys to listen to me!!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by altiain
Now that I think, that is right. My car was so loose at the last event I made, that I went with a bigger split.
Got some Victoracers today along with a lovely pamphlet from Kumho on the Installation and Use of my V700s!
In the section on alignment they state, “if Camber is adjustable, most cars will perform best when camber is adjusted into the –2 deg. To –3 deg range. Caster settings can enhance straight-line stability and cornering traction, and if adjustable, should be set at the maximum positive value for the vehicle.”
Sounds like you're gonna need a BIG hammer...Quote:
Originally Posted by POS Racing
from the Dyno get together we took the 92 autox car to Rick at fifth gear.with all the doc's from FM and miata.net garage and ask him to set the car up. I guess the real test will be at the next ER EVENT.
Numbers:
camber caster toe
F(D/P) -2.0/-1.9 5.1/4.8 -1/16
R(D/P) -1.9/-2.0 ------ -1/16
great people to work with lots of info just wish my senior moments would let me rember more.
I han an alignment done at the Firestone in Hurst. I think that the equipement and tec are more important than the name on the building.
As some of you may know I bought this car witha a wrecked front end and needed to replace the whole front supension. Before the alignment the specs where:
front
camber (in degrees) L=-0.46 R=-0.26
caster L=2.52 R=2.74
toe L=-0.13 R=1.56
Rear
Camber L=-0.73 R=-0.67
Toe L=-0.08 R=0.21
Trust angle =-0.14
After the alignment the following:
front
camber (in degrees) L=-1.08 R=-1.05
caster L=2.96 R=3.12
toe L=-0.01 R=0.01
Rear
Camber L=-1.81 R=-1.83
Toe L=-0.09 R=0.07
Trust angle =-0.01
the before and after driving? before the car was more stable at highway speeds and did nort tend to want to wander or twitch.
On Autoxing on turn in it had to be turned into the corners, now you just have to almost think about turning and it goes where you ask it to go. it was also loose into the corners and tight coming out, not really fast. now it is pretty much nutral into the corners and a little loose coming out. At the last Autox at pennington, I was a littel tight on exit and was able to adjust the tire pressure and make the rear looser.
Overall I'm happy with the setup and the guy at Firestone took the extra time to make the car as close to the specs that I wanted.
Paul
So far the tire wear is even across the rear and wearing on the outside on the front. I thik that is because of autoxing.
I would agree about the tech, We used Firestone just down the street in Flower Mound on both the miata and always to our specs.
The last time in on the red/back they had the car all day, never called back and then balk at doing the work when I dropped by.
So the search began. Rick at Fifth Gear was as I said before a great resource.
Sunday will be the test?
Is that Peterson's automotive services in Haltom City????
Yep.Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy Blaze
Thanks, I will call them and get a price quote and set an apointment.
I think it's like $75 for an alignment. I'll also warn you that Peterson's doesn't do appointments - first come, first served.Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy Blaze
Even better, great price and I will just show up before they open.
Thanks for the heads up!!
I went this morning for my new alignment. I would suggest an early morning visit- probably later in the week is less busy than a Mon/Tues. Just my experience.Quote:
Originally Posted by altiain
Note also, both Petersons' there are all business. They don't have time to jack around with 'customers'. The mechanics are friendly tho.
I personally don't care if they don't have time to talk to me unless they are the ones doing the allignment :wink:
joe.miataWhat is the difference between the "extreme" and "mild" from Peterson. Joe, do you think it is that much better for AX? How about tire wear on the street?Quote:
I was asked if I wanted the 'extreme' race alignment or the 'mild' race alignment. I'm going back this year for the 'extreme.'
I think its their way of asking 'How much tire wear would you like?- mild or extreme?'Quote:
Originally Posted by gabkwong
I can't seem to get any more than 0.8-0.9 front camber- so I guess this my extreme setup.
They will set up the car to your numbers if you provide them. 'Mild or extreme' is used when you don't know what the numbers are.