RX-8 Engine Issues

Spoke with a Mazda mechanic friend of mine about a Miata issues and while I was there he was working on a RX-8. He stated they are having a lot of engines going out do to poor oiling and had a feeling that there may be a recall coming soon. He said about 70% of the engines that are having problems are having the engines replaced under warranty. This could be the end of the rotary if this keeps happening. Most likely Mazda was probably running the oil injection on the lean side for emmisions and this caught up with them.

I bring this up in case you have one, know someone that has one or were thinking about buying one. I would stay shy of buying one if I were you.

Dawg

:shock:

What a pity that would be, but your analysis seems spot on. Sheesh, if the RX-8 dies and the MX-5 doesn't rediscover its soul, Mazda will become just another purveyor of sporty but unremarkable FWD cars. :(

S.

Thanks for the tip Trackdog. The RX-8 was on my list of top 3 candidates.

Since the RX8 uses a bit of oil normally wonder how many of the failures are caused by a low oil level condition???

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Originally Posted by POS Racing

Since the RX8 uses a bit of oil normally wonder how many of the failures are caused by a low oil level condition???

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I'm wondering the same thing... How many engines are being replaced for n00bs vs. how many for experienced RX owners. These things drink oil - the harder you hit the gas, the more they drink. If they aren't checking them then they will run low.

RJ

Interesting information Gary. I'd hate to see the rotaries go away all together. The RX-8 is a great car and I'm really enjoying my RX-7 right now.

I was told it was an issue with the electronic setup. By the way they have a huge fuse/relay box about 6" x 12" long full of fuses and relays. They are reflashing new data to try to improve the oil ratio, but if the damage is done already then it is on borrowed time. Apparently with the reduced oil the seals are cutting into the coated rotor housings and well you can imagine what happens next.

Dawg

yeah, I've been hearing that issue...

http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?t=68582

seems not al lthat uncommon..

whoa, an rotary grenading? Thats never happened before.

A voluntary recall gets my respect though...if it happens. VW put rings in upside down in a few thousand cars, then told thier owners to deal with burning over 1qt per 1000 miles. You should see what that does to piston walls, especially the ring lands.


I wonder how much Mazda really cares about its enthusiest buyer base? They seem to be selling enough cars now that if the Miata is a bust (which it is) they'll still survive.

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Originally Posted by mr brg

They seem to be selling enough cars now that if the Miata is a bust (which it is) they'll still survive.

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How do you figure? The 2006 NC sales exceeded projections, and the PRT appears to be a home run from a sales standpoint.

The 3 is doing very well. The 6 isn't doing bad either.

looks like Mazda's actually doing well selling their 'normal' car line-up these days... Something kinda new for them..

Mazda3
Mazad5
Mazda6
Tribute
CX-7

Those all seem to be selling fairly well.. Well enough that most dealers can't seem to keep much on an inventory on hand..

Rotoaries have a tendancy to be finicky.. That'll always be the case. I wonder how many of teh motor replacements could have been prevented by a bit of 'owner education'

Here are some actual sales figures from Mazda! :burnrubr:

Wow, that is not very many cars combined when you think of other manufacturers. Looks like the 38% drop in RX-8 sales may be the telling story of the end.

Dawg

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Originally Posted by trackdog

Wow, that is not very many cars combined when you think of other manufacturers. Looks like the 38% drop in RX-8 sales may be the telling story of the end.

Dawg

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Think the SUV like gas mileage may also have something to do with the low sales on the RX8.

Have you ever run across anyone with an RX8 that didn't bitch about the gas mileage. ;)

I think the life cycle of designs have a lot to do with it too... The oldest designs seem to be the ones that trail off, and new designs get a good bump.

The 3 sells like crazy, and it should. When I was in California a few weeks ago, I had my Mom's Z3 (2.3 ver) and dads Mazda3 (2.0 ver). I had more fun in the twisties in the 3... that is one cool little car, and I got around 35 mpg.

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Originally Posted by Titus

and I got around 35 mpg.

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Nice work, sunshine. :cat: How slow were you driving to achieve that figure?

S.

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Originally Posted by srivendel

Nice work, sunshine. :cat: How slow were you driving to achieve that figure?

S.

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The 35 mpg was for the 200 mile round trip to pick us up from the airport followed by a 200 mile round trip to see the grandmothers with the daughter in the backseat... yes, I am told they typically fill it up every 400 miles. My Dad says he beats on it like crazy and has never had a tank dip below 30 mpg.

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Originally Posted by trackdog

Wow, that is not very many cars combined when you think of other manufacturers. Looks like the 38% drop in RX-8 sales may be the telling story of the end.

Dawg

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nope, that's very true.. but then again, they don't have teh capacity of most of the others either... When you figure Ford was selling 400,000 Taruses in it's heyday, Mazda looks kinda puny ;) But at teh same time.. Mazda is selling pretty much all tehy make of their newer models.. I think that says something good :D

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Originally Posted by rx7gslse

nope, that's very true.. but then again, they don't have teh capacity of most of the others either... When you figure Ford was selling 400,000 Taruses in it's heyday, Mazda looks kinda puny ;) But at teh same time.. Mazda is selling pretty much all tehy make of their newer models.. I think that says something good :D

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Now what if you counted all of the Fords that are based on Mazda engineering? ;)

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Originally Posted by Titus

Now what if you counted all of the Fords that are based on Mazda engineering? ;)

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Escape, Fusion, Milan the new baby Lincoln, some unreleased ford SUV, Euro Focus, Volvo S40.. what others am I forgetting?

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Originally Posted by rx7gslse

Escape, Fusion, Milan the new baby Lincoln, some unreleased ford SUV, Euro Focus, Volvo S40.. what others am I forgetting?

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Now were talking some production numbers! ;)

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Originally Posted by general default

Thanks for the tip Trackdog. The RX-8 was on my list of top 3 candidates.

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Inquiring minds want to know what the other two were. :wink:

I've heard of the problem for awhile, but I'm not convinced that this isn't an "owner education" issue. A lot of people buying RX-8s have never owned a rotary before, and don't understand that you can't just treat them like a ocnventional reciprocating engine.

The RX-8 has been on my short list as a Miata replacement later this year, but since I have access to one that I don't have to pay for or put gasoline in, I may buy something else instead.

So, it will be a great opportunity to get real TCB deal when they pull the plug on the RX8 just like the last few NC RX7 on the lots a decade ago.

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Originally Posted by trackdog

Spoke with a Mazda mechanic friend of mine about a Miata issues and while I was there he was working on a RX-8. He stated they are having a lot of engines going out do to poor oiling and had a feeling that there may be a recall coming soon. He said about 70% of the engines that are having problems are having the engines replaced under warranty. This could be the end of the rotary if this keeps happening. Most likely Mazda was probably running the oil injection on the lean side for emmisions and this caught up with them.

I bring this up in case you have one, know someone that has one or were thinking about buying one. I would stay shy of buying one if I were you.

Dawg

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Yep, I hate to dog on a Mazda, especially a rotary, but I would half to agree with ya here. A friend's mother just had her engine replaced and the car has had multiple engine computer updates and has been in the shop half the time.:(

I don't understand why they don't throw in the towel on the rotory, and just put a 4 or 6 cyl in those cars. I would think a 4cly would fit, but the 6 would give it the sporty feel it deserves.

BTW, the 2007 RHT is showing up on my radar as a possible new purchase, of course I'll wait till it's out a while, but since I'm about to payoff my current Miata, and only have a bit over a year on the trailblazer (that I can't find a home for) left, I'm trying to talk my wife into the RHT Miata as a second car for herself. I'm OK with having 4 cars, especially since I've got a 15 year old that will soon be driving. We'll probably put him in the Trailblazer, or my old '93 p/u.

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Originally Posted by TurboDuane

or my old '93 p/u.

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A vote for the p/u. It's my believe that the more passengers a kid can hall around, the more likely they are to get themselves into trouble. If you can eliminate the backseat without adding performance, he should be just a little bit safer.

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Originally Posted by Titus

A vote for the p/u. It's my believe that the more passengers a kid can hall around, the more likely they are to get themselves into trouble. If you can eliminate the backseat without adding performance, he should be just a little bit safer.

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+1

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Originally Posted by Titus

A vote for the p/u. It's my believe that the more passengers a kid can hall around, the more likely they are to get themselves into trouble. If you can eliminate the backseat without adding performance, he should be just a little bit safer.

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VETOED!

I would have to say from personal experience, the pickup may be the worst choice second only to say a new Vette!

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Originally Posted by icepenguin66

VETOED!

I would have to say from personal experience, the pickup may be the worst choice second only to say a new Vette!

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OK... there has to be a story there.. due tell! I had a pickup for part of my teen years and generally got in a lot less trouble then when I had a car full of people.

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Originally Posted by Titus

OK... there has to be a story there.. due tell! I had a pickup for part of my teen years and generally got in a lot less trouble then when I had a car full of people.

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If you give a kid a p/u you need to put a locking flat-topped bed cover on it. This will help keep them from doing stupid (and illegal) things like piling a bunch of friends in the back.

RJ

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Originally Posted by Titus

OK... there has to be a story there.. due tell! I had a pickup for part of my teen years and generally got in a lot less trouble then when I had a car full of people.

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I have to say I'm in agreement with Ice-P on this one. Pick-ups are light in the rear end and tend to have lo-traction tires. That's a recipe for winding up in a ditch on a slick road. They also lack the crash integrity of most cars of similar vintage. Plus, there's always the risk that they'll fill the bed full of people, which can lead to BIG accidents. I agree that a four door isn't the best choice for a teenage driver, and that you want them to be able to take as few friends as possible, but I don't see pickups as a particularly good choice.

How about an old Civic hatchback or a CRX?

http://i13.ebayimg.com/03/i/07/c8/fa/c6_12.JPG

S.

Well, I guess I don't know what the law is out here, but passengers in the bed of a truck is a big no-no in CA, so this wasn't a problem. Hell, even dogs had to be on a tether if they road in the bed.

The truck I had was a gutless 4 cylinder, and I never had a problem with the backend coming around. The only time I got into trouble like that was when I was driving my Dad's late 80's V8 Thunderbird with 6 kids packed into it.

The CRX would be an even better solution than the truck... 2 seats, little power, and FWD.

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Originally Posted by Titus

The CRX would be an even better solution than the truck... 2 seats, little power, and FWD.

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Just check to make sure it has the dinky low power engine that isn't ricer material for building up. ::Angel::

I still managed to fit 5 in my CRX. That was the most practical college car though.

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Originally Posted by Sharpie

I still managed to fit 5 in my CRX. That was the most practical college car though.

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Upon further thought, I'm thinking Del Slow might be better. The older CRXs would be hard to come by with mileage low enough to feel reliable for a young kid, and I too remember turning a friend's CRX into a clown car.

I wasn't going to reply here for fear of drifting this thread. But It has definately taken it's course.

I'm planning on starting him in the '93 Dakoda v-6-auto for two to three months, as it's already beat up. Then I'll move him into something else. I just haven't decided what yet. It may be the trailBlazer, if we still have it, provided my wife gets a new car, or we may sell the TB and buy him something else. The wife isn't comfortable with him in a really small car like the crx or Miata, as shes afraid it won't protect him enough. I personally would like to put him in a Miata, but I'm getting a big Heck No from the boss.

Then the plan is during his senior year is to build up a car for him for graduation. Of course he wants a Late model Supra :rolleyes: or an old muscle car, but time will tell, and all will be based on his driving skills and maturity level, and decisions he makes while driving. Bottom line is he'll graduate with a cool car that we will have gone through,so it should be reliable and will serve as a base that can be modded as he has the time and/or money.

Oh, and of course, he's going to have to have several auto-x's under his belt first, so he can learn how easy it is to loose control when pushing a car.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oXr3b8LO9m8

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Originally Posted by Titus

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oXr3b8LO9m8

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Sweet if the survey results are not what ya want just change the way ya do the surveys! ::Angel::

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Originally Posted by Titus

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oXr3b8LO9m8

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For those of us who can't stream video at work, can we get a Reader's Digest version of the link?