Texas FI'ed cooling solution?

Anyone local running a custom Spal fan setup or underpan that keeps their FI'ed car cool under nearly all conditions? My FMII '99 is doing a LOT better than my '97 used to, although I'd like to get it cooling off even beter.. Global warming and all :)

The scoop from BEGI looks interesting, although they don't have a kit for the FM intercooler yet... And while FM has their dual fan setup, nearly $500 is too much. I haven't talked to Gary at TDR, although the website doesn't list anything I haven't seen before..

And yes, I'm already running a FM radiator (shrouded on top) with water and Purple Ice (comparable to Water Wetter).

I haven't figured out the correct formula yet, but from what I have read fans do help. I did some research on FM's Spal fans and they are no different than the Spal fans you can buy anywhere else. I am looking at adding some this summer as well just need to decide on which ones I'm going with.

Yea, I dug up these for $315 on spal's site:
http://etxiow.accpaconline.com/itemd...&item=30102052

And then found the same fans for $240 here:
http://www.jaycorptech.com/showprodu...4&categoryid=2

Interested in doing a group install?

Yeah I have that same one on my truck and it works well. I believe that it is the same size as our radiator including the tanks so mods would have to be made to make it fit. Loud is the other word I would use to describe that fan. I need to take another look at making this work.

How loud exactly?

The top one looks like what i have on my car now. They're not too loud, but it's noticable. I installed them early june and have yet to see over 100 on the key pad. They seem to be working great, I have driven around town and on the highway, but have not been stuck in traffic for 30 minutes.

Did you order them through Spal or ? Any pricing info? What was the install like?

I bought them used, so it was just mounting the relays, and splicing a bunch of wires. I got a TCB deal with an aluminum radiator. Used FM's instructions and it went pretty easy. I know they weren't bought from FM, but they sure look like them. Sorry I can't provide more info.

I've fashioned a home built air-damn under the front spoiler, then made a box to keep any air from slipping around the i/c, cond, and radiator. My temps are always below 98 w/ the A/C off. Normal temps with out the a/c is around 92-94c. With A/C on, I'm getting 96 to 104c in traffic. If stuck in stop/go traffic It will climb when the a/c is on but seems to stop at around 108c. I've got my Max temp set to 110c and have never had the link cut power due to over heating, except at a S2000 event last year, but that was prior to the mod.

Prior to the air-damn and the box, I would run up to 108c on the hi-way at 75mph w/A/C, and would get to over 110c in stop and go traffic.

I've got all the cooling mods, FM Radiator, Dual Spal's, Oil cooler, 16 lbs radiator cap, 80/20 mixture.

Unfortanetly with the '99 link it doesn't tell you temps, so I'm just going by the gauge. Based on what I remember from my '97, any movement at all isn't a good sign.

The car does highway miles with a/c on without trouble, it's just prolonged stop-n-go that worries me.

The straight blade fans are pretty loud. I can hear them in my truck with the windows up, but they move the required air.

Here is a good thread on the pointy board:
http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=196450

Some good discussion there as I have the same high speed overheating problems they are speaking of.

Forgot about the TDR "mouthpieces" that we installed before Hallett last year. They seal things up pretty nice, sounds a lot like what Duane did.

Explain "mouthpieces"?

I made my mouthpeace that is connected to the radiator intake on the front bumper. It seals up all excape routes for the air, so the air is forced through the radiator, cond., and i/cooler.

I used to have a problem when on the highway, but not anymore.

Got any pics? I wouldn't mind taking a look in person either... Actually, I haven't met anyone local who has a FI miata since I had my '97. Next time you guys get together at Gary's or whatever, let me know.

-s

We cut the side panels off the belly pan on all FI cars, big improvement for getting the hot air out and circulates the air more efficiently around the header taking away heat. I am sure you have wired the fans in parallel, standard procedure for all Miatas FI or not.

Your setup has poor efficiency of capturing the airflow in the mouth of the radiator, even more with the FM intercooler, add additional panels if necessary and consider using high temperature-moisture resistent aluminum foil tape to seal off air leaks. You can get some at the hardware store in the A/C insulation department. Some of their tape is not high temperature (250F or higher) so read the label. If you can not find it we stock it.

The stock fans are powerful enough to pull a lot of heat out of your radiator, you just need to improve the airflow.

Gary

I wouldn't mind seeing this firsthand. Does TDR have a shop at the addy on the website, or is that just the business address?

The dallas address is our TDR warehouse. Even though I am there during the week, you are better off coming to the Dog House in Plano on the weekend.

Call or come by at 3105 Saddlehead Dr., Plano. Glad to help.

Gary

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Originally Posted by trackdog

We cut the side panels off the belly pan on all FI cars, big improvement for getting the hot air out and circulates the air more efficiently around the header taking away heat. I am sure you have wired the fans in parallel, standard procedure for all Miatas FI or not.

Your setup has poor efficiency of capturing the airflow in the mouth of the radiator, even more with the FM intercooler, add additional panels if necessary and consider using high temperature-moisture resistent aluminum foil tape to seal off air leaks. You can get some at the hardware store in the A/C insulation department. Some of their tape is not high temperature (250F or higher) so read the label. If you can not find it we stock it.

The stock fans are powerful enough to pull a lot of heat out of your radiator, you just need to improve the airflow.

Gary

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So you cut the side panel completely off on both sides? There is a nut that keeps the side panel on the car. Would the side panel still be stable without flapping around if I cut all that off?

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Originally Posted by chuckerants

So you cut the side panel completely off on both sides? There is a nut that keeps the side panel on the car. Would the side panel still be stable without flapping around if I cut all that off?

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I think he is referring to the NB, which may have a different bellypan than the NA? I don't think he cut anything off of the sides of my NA bellypan when he installed my intercooler, but I could be wrong.

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Originally Posted by Titus

I think he is referring to the NB, which may have a different bellypan than the NA? I don't think he cut anything off of the sides of my NA bellypan when he installed my intercooler, but I could be wrong.

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I have a 99.

With the sides trimmed on my 05 I have no "flapping" or any other problems, even at above highway speeds

Well, due to my car getting to 230F in traffic, I recently replaced my thermostat with a 180F Stant. I don't remember the last time the T-stat was changed so I hoped this would help.

Before, I would get to 210F and stay there until I started getting stuck in stop and go traffic. That's when the temp gauge would read upto 230F -speed up and down to 210F again.

After the new T-Stat, I get to 195F until I started driving in slow traffic. I haven't had a chance to drive in stop and go traffic again, but yesterday the temp gauge read 200F or so driving at 45MPH. So, it looks like the new T-Stat only helped a little bit and really only is holding off the inevitable.

FWIW, my temp sender is tapped into the upper rad hose coming out of the t-Stat housing going into the radiator.

I may try trimming the side as Gary suggested.

I think I'll be going with a Spal fan setup of some kind (FM's or some other) as well. If I'm moving I have no cooling problems, even with the AC on. But if I hit heavy traffic on a normal July afternoon temps start to climb toward melt-down. The stock fans just can't pull enough cool air. I replaced the stock 180 thermostat with a 160 and that did help a ton! Unfortunately the outside temp immediately dropped 15 degrees and hasn't been back, so I don't know how well the 160 thermostat will work when it's 110 outside.

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Originally Posted by scmx5driver

I think I'll be going with a Spal fan setup of some kind (FM's or some other) as well. If I'm moving I have no cooling problems, even with the AC on. But if I hit heavy traffic on a normal July afternoon temps start to climb toward melt-down. The stock fans just can't pull enough cool air. I replaced the stock 180 thermostat with a 160 and that did help a ton! Unfortunately the outside temp immediately dropped 15 degrees and hasn't been back, so I don't know how well the 160 thermostat will work when it's 110 outside.

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I'm very skeptical as to the 160F thermostat helping overheating. I went from a 195F to the 180F and while it does take longer to get to full temp, my car eventually still settles at 210F with both 180F and 195F thermostat.

Additionally, the Miata's operating temperature is supposed to be at "around" 210F. If you are running your Miata much cooler than that, I doubt that is helping your engine operate under full effeciency.

Your car SHOULD have no problems maintaining temps while moving. I think what we are all (big assumption) trying to do is to try to maintain that same temps while sitting still in traffic. Which is why we are trying running the fans in parellel, as well as improving engine bay airflow. Also, according to Gary, the OEM fans are enough to keep our cars cool. I don't know enough about this yet to disagree with him, so I'm working with the asumption that he is correct.

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Originally Posted by chuckerants

Also, according to Gary, the OEM fans are enough to keep our cars cool. I don't know enough about this yet to disagree with him, so I'm working with the asumption that he is correct.

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I think that Gary is saying that stock fans move enough air IN PARALLEL. Mine, along with everyone car I have heard of with stock fans (not paralleled) and an Intercooler have problems with the heat creeping up in stop and go traffic when it is over 100* out. I have had this problem, and it sounds like most in this thread have too. I plan on implementing the parallel mod over the winter and will look for a change next summer. If it still has problems, I will look to SPAL.

I'm meeting with Tom @ FFS tmorrow so I can try out the new PC Pro on my car. The PC Pro as Tom will be selling it will come with a PnP wire harness which will make wiring in additional accessories a piece of cake. For example, I will be doing the parellel fan mod on the PnP wire harness before I plug in the PC Pro to see if it has an affect on the coolant temp.

Well I have no problems keeping cool in traffic, but I do at high speeds. I still think airflow and fans are the solution.

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Originally Posted by Flyin96M

Well I have no problems keeping cool in traffic, but I do at high speeds. I still think airflow and fans are the solution.

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The fans don't turn at high speed. They really don't need to.

The fans have helped my car cool down. Hallett in a few weeks will be the big test.

Temperatures increasing due to A/C or stop and go traffic is normal and should not be a concern. if you are NOT overflowing the radiator fluid out of the overfill bottle then most likely you are fine.

Adding the 160 F t-stat works great during the 9 months of the year and would recommend for FI cars in particular. I see about 175 F on average on the street and at the track very seldom see over 215 F range when it is 90 deg. out. During winter it takes a long time to get the heater working so something to think about if your car is a daily driver.

On the dual fan setup, the stock fans are more than adequate. Give you an idea, even with our TDR intercooler in front you can hold a piece of paper in front of the grill and it will suck it straight in. We have never had an over heat issue on the track or on the street with the A/C on, stop and stop more Dallas traffic.

Setup the dual fans, cut the side panels off the belly pan (after the radiator on M1 cars) and limit air loses entering the radiator. We sell a radiator cover for 90-97 cars that covers the top section, this would be beneficial if you don't have something now.

Gary

Just so we are all on the same page, where are you getting your temp reading?

I have an Autometer electric temp sender in the upper rad hose going from the T-Stat housing to the radiator.

After doing the parellel fan mod, I do have temps that are no higher than 200~210F.