Equipe Rapide Event #3 @ Mineral Wells, 5/29/11

Hey all,

It is never too soon to announce the next event. Equipe Rapide will be hosting Challenge Cup #3 on May 29th in Mineral Wells. We have lots of fun stuff planned. Mike McShane has offered to do a hula dance with the grass skirt and coconut top during the drivers meeting. Jerrett will be accompanying him on the ukulele. Mick will be jumping his car through a fire ring and stack of burning hay bales. Mark Wortham has thrown down the gauntlett stating that he will give $100 to anyone who can beat his time in his car. I plan on taking about 25 runs in his car.

I hope to see you all there,

That sounds like a blast!

I look really good in a grass skirt...

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Originally Posted by OZMDD

I look really good in a grass skirt...

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Braggart!

Now that's what I'd call event promotion!

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Originally Posted by nomadtrash

We have lots of fun stuff planned. Mike McShane has offered to do a hula dance with the grass skirt and coconut top during the drivers meeting. Jerrett will be accompanying him on the ukulele. Mick will be jumping his car through a fire ring and stack of burning hay bales.

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This stuff alone makes it worth the long drive and $40 in fuel, but when you throw in this:

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Originally Posted by nomadtrash

Mark Wortham has thrown down the gauntlett stating that he will give $100 to anyone who can beat his time in his car.

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I've got to come. Does it have to be a clean run? :D

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Originally Posted by nomadtrash

Mark Wortham has thrown down the gauntlett stating that he will give $100 to anyone who can beat his time in his car.

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I'd be down for this....

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Originally Posted by nomadtrash

Mark Wortham has thrown down the gauntlett stating that he will give $100 to anyone who can beat his time in his car. I plan on taking about 25 runs in his car.

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What's the buy in?

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Originally Posted by nomadtrash

Mike McShane has offered to do a hula dance with the grass skirt and coconut top during the drivers meeting. Jerrett will be accompanying him on the ukulele. Mick will be jumping his car through a fire ring and stack of burning hay bales.

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Again?

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Originally Posted by nomadtrash

Mark Wortham has thrown down the gauntlett stating that he will give $100 to anyone who can beat his time in his car. I plan on taking about 25 runs in his car.

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Yes, this offer is valid, but you've got 1 run to get it done and the price of admission is $100 per driver. ;)

I would not worry about Solo RX-7... He will never figure out how to release the parking brake.
See his article here. http://texasscca.org/Forums/tabid/95...s/Default.aspx :D

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Originally Posted by Solo RX-7

Now that's what I'd call event promotion.

I've got to come. Does it have to be a clean run? :D

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Equipe Rapide is excited to announce our Memorial Day Weekend charity event. Challenge Cup #3 is at Mineral Wells on Sunday May 29th. We will be donating 100% of the net proceeds to ReserveAid.
ReserveAid is a 501(c)(3) nonprofit organization committed to providing financial support to the families of Reserve Service Members from all services, who have been called to active duty and are experiencing financial difficulty. Their goal is to alleviate the emotional and financial burdens placed on the men and women called to serve our country by supporting their families at home.
Memorial Day is a holiday observed to commemorate those in the military who have lost their lives during military service. Assisting our current troops is a way to honor their memories. I urge you to come out to Mineral Wells on May 29th and show your support to our local military families.
You can check out the ReserveAid website at www.reserveaid.org.

I've got to tow the ER trailer so I won't be able to bring my car. Is there anyone that wants to offer a co-drive?

http://autocross.com/er/ER-ReserveAid.jpg

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One week left to get pre-registered. We will accept on-site registrations.

I'm down for this...is there a place to reg online??

You can register at AXWare. There is a link and instructions on our website.

Considering attending this event, but I have a couple questions:

1) Will cars from the same class run in the same heats?

2) Will "board member$" be allowed to $pread their run$ out over $everal heat$ to en$ure optimal condition$ for their Rapid Pax run$?

Thanks!

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Originally Posted by SRSBZNSSOZMDDF1

1) Will cars from the same class run in the same heats?
2) Will "board member$" be allowed to $pread their run$ out over $everal heat$ to en$ure optimal condition$ for their Rapid Pax run$?

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1. No
2. Anyone who does not have an in heat work assignment (setup, cleanup, registration, etc) can run whenever they want.

OK, same-old same-old then. Thought I'd heard talk of changing that.

Why don't same-class cars run together? Wouldn't that make the results more accurate?

If Rapid Pax money is on the line, then wouldn't it be more fair to have all competitiors racing under similar conditions?

What is it about a plum work assignment that makes it necessary to run in several heats?

Isn't the intent of the rule to allow people who have jobs that require them to be busy throughout the event to get in all their runs eventually, not to simply allow certain individuals to run at-will?

How much of the Rapid Pax profits (the funds not paid-out to competitors) will go to the Reserve Aid fund?

Thanks. Not going to attend.

We are donating all the net proceeds to reserveaid. Once we figure out how much the insurance, site rental, and other expenses are then all the rest of the money will be donated. At this event we expect to pay out more in Rapide PAX than we will bring in so it will be an expense. Rapide Pax winners can keep their payouts or they can donate them like they have in the past.

I would appreciate it if you would share with me any ideas you have for changes to the run-work order and Rapide PAX. We have a board meeting tomorrow night and you are welcome to attend.

Thanks,

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Originally Posted by OZMDD

What is it about a plum work assignment that makes it necessary to run in several heats?

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Dam those people that show up early and/or stay late to put on an event;)

I see your point but if everyone's making their pax runs who works the course and timing?

I will agree that ER seems to have a problem with falling numbers and having the same people run in the afternoon at every event may be part of it.
I am fine with the way things are, but I have one of those plum assignments this event, (I will only run in 1 heat) but I would also be open to change if that would get more people out.


edit

I have always enjoyed the PAX class, but is it causing more hard feeling than it's worth?

I reviewed the last 10 years or so and found that we have no problem with falling numbers. We are where we always have been, North Texas best kept autocrossing secret.

That is good to know. I guess it just seems like the numbers have been falling.

Unfortunately the board meeting is 40+ miles from my house. :)

My suggestion is that cars run in the same heat as their competitors, like most other autox clubs and SCCA. Simple.

My only concern with rapid pax is that all competitors should be on as equal a footing as is possible. If someone's work assignment precludes them from getting all runs in the same heat, that's understandable (safety, event master, protest), but someone who has already worked or will work after the event ought to take all their runs in a single heat. Unless someone is trying to mix work and runs (like the President or timing-setup person often has had to in the past),what possible reason is there for taking runs in different heats, other than to gain a competitive advantage and win money? If a board member is called-away to handle something during runs, let them finish in the next heat. If that's not the motivation for spreading-out runs, then why not run in a single heat?

This question has been asked numerous times, and no one has given a clear answer yet other than "that's the way ER does it. I attended a board meeting last year, raised the exact same questions, listened to John Garcia threaten to sue any and everyone present, and was told that it would be looked-into and considered.

You're a good guy Andy, but I'd still like to know why things are done so differently in ER than elsewhere.

Fair points Ozmdd.

Robert - I'm not suggesting that pax runs be taken all-together, that is the luck-of-the-draw with the class heat. I'm saying that is is unfair for someone to take 1 or 2 runs early, adjust their car, watch some other runs, run a few more runs, adjust some more, let their codriver(s) take runs, wait till the end of the event, then take their PAX runs and win $$ every event.

In other clubs, effort is made to rotate the run/work from event to event so no class is running in the best/worst conditions repeatedlty. Its not hard to do; I sort it out myself every NTAXS event, and we have much larger classes to juggle. Some events you'll end-up running in the "best" conditions for your car/tires, and some events you won't. That's autox. I don't think anyone minds, so long as it seems to balance-out over time.

I got raw-timed by some crappy STS car at the Div on Sunday, and it might have been better driving, but it also might have had something to do with the 10 degree warm-up from 1st to 3rd heats. :) Since my class ran in the same heat, it only affected my pride.

Edit - BTW, I have been finishing in the PAX money for the last 6-8 months; this is not sour grapes.

As opposed to the crazy hot lapping @ NTAXS, BMW and PCA?

At the beginning of the season, one of the perks of prepaying with ER is that you can choose a permanent work assignment, like corner in the first heat.

So, those individuals that consistently run with ER, by putting their money where their mouth is by prepaying, get a perk.

The split run never bothered me because the mod drivers were the ones doing it and they aren't the speediest bunch anyway.

I like my perk of the permanent work assignment, but I would give it up if it would get more cars out, and maybe it would if the less commited did not feel like they always get the bad work/run assignment at ER events. I don't really know if it would make any real differance, seems like all the clubs have a hard time getting people out to Mineral Wells.

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Originally Posted by goofygrin

As opposed to the crazy hot lapping @ NTAXS, BMW and PCA?

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I am not sure that how we stage cars has anything to do with Mike's comments. Mike's concerns primarily regard the inequalities of running members of the same class in different heats.

Goofy - you are correct its a different animal at those events. but EVERYONE runs the same way, and classes do run together. Also, you are allowed to delay your run to cool-down or tweak the car, so long as you finish your runs in the same heat. Not criticizing the format so much as the unequal application of that format.

I think the prepay perk is good, in terms of choosing a work assignment. I think it hurts the club to guarantee the same heat. Nothing wrong with rewarding paying members, but not in a way that is a competitive advantage. Working first, running second IS a competitive advantage, IMHO.

The SCCA prepay gets ya a fixed work assignment plus you run with your class.

I'll add that I see the NTAXS/BMW events as less rigid since there's no money or real season trophy on the line, so a bit of tomfoolery is ok.

Personally, from the ER side, I think that they are pretty flexible on some things (custom classes for clubs and that sort of thing) and the rapide pax "element of chance" (snowballs in my case) adds a different degree of fun. I never had any issue with the way the club was run under Gerry or Andy. I do have issues with Mineral Wells (it's too far and a cheesegrater on tires).

I see ER as a more laid back, high competition event... like a practice for SCCA events.

If I'd had a [competitive] Miata or S2k then the NTAXS would have been less like practice for me.

/thread derailed

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Originally Posted by goofygrin

I'll add that I see the NTAXS/BMW events as less rigid since there's no money or real season trophy on the line, so a bit of tomfoolery is ok.

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Again, you keep grasping a straws at the expense of my club. Yes, we (NTAXS) will make the occasional consession for someone with a special need, and I would hope that ER, SCCA, BMW, and PCA would do the same. However, Mike's primary concern is that members of the same class running in different heats is a part of ER's general procedures. It is not a general procedure for the other clubs that you mention.

BTW, I plan to attend the event. If I don't, it will not be because of ER's procedures or anything that they have or have not done. Regardless if I win or lose, I still enjoy the time behind the wheel and I find that worth the cost of entry. As Conecerned likes to say, it will have been the best autocross I attended all day.

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Originally Posted by jrj512

Again, you keep grasping a straws at the expense of my club. Yes, we (NTAXS) will make the occasional consession for someone with a special need, and I would hope that ER, SCCA, BMW, and PCA would do the same. However, Mike's primary concern is that members of the same class running in different heats is a part of ER's general procedures. It is not a general procedure for the other clubs that you mention.

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I'm not saying that the NTAXS/BMW events aren't fun, good value or, IMO better value than SCCA and ER. You do have to admit that they are a touch more chaotic and are more loose and open since there's no classing issues, rigid rule structures, etc. For casual autox'ers the format is better.

Stop thinking that I'm peeing on your baby. I always tell people to go to a BMW or NTAXS event rather than SCCA or ER. More runs, less $$, less crazy rules.

Warning more thread drift. But had to correct an inaccuracy.

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Originally Posted by goofygrin

I'll add that I see the NTAXS/BMW events as less rigid since there's no money or real season trophy on the line, ...

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This year's season trophy was very nice, just like last year's, and prior years. Several classes came down to the last event.

When was the last BMW event you attended?

I'm glad Ken piped up so that we have someone other than ER to bag on.

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Originally Posted by nomadtrash

I'm glad Ken piped up so that we have someone other than ER to bag on.

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So we will see you at the BMW events?

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So we will see you at the BMW events?

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When my wife makes my allowance bigger. Currently, I only get $40 per week for lunch money.

I could stand to skip a few lunches.

I have a trophy from every club except NTAXS and PCA. BMW's are the fanciest, though I can drink from my ER trophies, so that's a plus.

I hope this doesn't become a club-vs-club situation, as that is not my intent, nor is it a good argument (apples/oranges). I simply want to feel like I'm competing against my class when I attend an autox. ER's system prevents that, and I think it'd be a good change to make.

My comments about certain members running in multiple heats have been addressed, so I'll give ER the benefit of the doubt that everyone will play by "fair" standards.

ER is a club with lots of history that does a lot of things very well. They are the only club to take-on the complex challenge of a Rapid Pax event, and it is a cool thing.

I think a lot of people have mistaken ideas about the quality of events being held by NTAXS and BMW, but that's because those peopel haven't been to one since new leadership took over. They are top-notch events now, and have been selling-out in advance lately.

Sorry to derail the thread Andy; I really just wanted to see if the ER system for run/work had been revised. I'll see if I can make it out Sunday.

The more the merrier. Hope to see you there.